I was out to the Rough & Tumble Engineers 60th Annual Treshermen's Reunion, this past Saturday.
Here is the video of their own Shay Railroad.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6sCKMuyQj8A

Len.

I was told this week, that the whistle is a Reading G 6er.
and it is also the whistle that was on 614 and the 425 earlier this year.

Len.

Question for all,
Were there 30" shays built or is this one rare?

Len.

While there were most likely a few 30" gauge Shays built by Lima (quite possibly for export), R&T's Shay is "homemade" replica vs. being a "real" Lima-built Shay. It was originally built during the early 1970's by a PRR Conductor and steam machinery fan named Bruce Groninger. He used a circa 1940 Fitzgibbons stationary boiler and a Soule 2-cylinder steam engine (which originally was used to power a sawmill log carriage back and forth). The Shay originally rode on handcar (or motorcar?) wheels and the trucks were assembled using assorted motor vehicle components with the final drive done by chains and sprockets. Air for braking was supplied (while moving) by a compressor belt-driven off the crankshaft. Over the years R&T people have rewoked the engine into something that comes much closer to passing for a actual Lima Shay. The engine now rides on more robust trucks that are far more in line with the design of what would be under a "real" Shay. A one lung steam air pump supplies braking air. Over the years the Shay has also received a turbogenerator and headlight plus some proper "jewelery" such as a number plate and class lights. A variety of whistles, mostly locomotive, have been used on the Shay including a long bell Hancock and the above mentioned RDG 6-chime. Interestingly, this little engine has been worked on over the years by a handfull of people that also could be found working on or around much larger and better known steam locomotives. People like the late DJ Shirey, Steve Gilbert, Warren Avis, and Eric Hessler come to mind. The R&T people can be very proud of what their machine has turned into. They also have done a fine job building two open passenger cars out of industrial flatcars and today their loop of track looks as good as some Class One track!

On a side note, R&T's other railroad, "Little Toot", a loop of 15" gauge track with a Crown 4-4-0 park train live-steam locomotive is still going strong. Their Crown, the first one built (in 1958) celebrated its 50th birthday this year.

Regards,
Jim Robinson

> On a side note, R&T's other railroad, "Little Toot", a loop of
> 15" gauge track with a Crown 4-4-0 park train live-steam
> locomotive is still going strong. Their Crown, the first one
> built (in 1958) celebrated its 50th birthday this year.

Where did that one originally operate?

Is the Crown at Knoebels still in operation?

Also, do you know any details on the Crown that used to be at Idlewild Park in Ligoneer? I think it was the one often featured in early Crown brochures/ads.

Is the Crown at Knoebels still in operation?

*Still operating as of last year; I HAD to take my wife to show her what an "old-time" amusement park was like!



Also, do you know any details on the Crown that used to be at Idlewild Park in Ligoneer? I think it was the one often featured in early Crown brochures/ads.

*http://www.knoebels.com/images/rides/OldSmokey.jpg Not sure if they still use a steam Crown or a diesel/gas.

R&T's Crown #1 has had only one home, that being at R&T. If my memory is right R&T bought the train (engine and 2 open top passenger cars) in 1959. It's been running in circles there ever since. The 4-wheel caboose on the train isn't from Crown but was "homemade by a late R&T member, Fred Fox, something like 20-25 years ago. Also the engine's extra tall diamond stack is a fairly recent addition.

Regards,
Jim Robinson

Thanks Jim,
Thank you for the interesting information on the history of the R&T Shay.
There was talk last year that a few members wanted to lay a thrid rail so they could run toot out on the main. but I haven't heard any news since last year.

Len.

Slightly O/T but most people here I think would enjoy Knoebels, it has the old fashioned carousel (complete with brass ring feature), a blacksmith shop and a woodshop, two railroads (the Crown & the faux steamers), ferris wheel & wooden coaster. Rides are for all tastes, from the sedate to the wild

There's no admission fee and and yesterday all day pass (minus the coaster) was $41.00 for yours truly and one not quite 42" 4.5 year old. Plus if you've never had Birch beer, they have the white (clear, no coloring) on fountain, plus restaurants and normal grease fortified park foods (fries, potato pancakes, etc)

Neat thing is the Catawissa caboose motel is nearby (I think still on rt 487) and if you head to Elysburg through Route 81, you get off on Exit 116 (to get to the park you take a left if on 81N). Head back the other way and you get to Minersville, present home of CNJ 113.

The Crown from Ligionier was of the 2' variety and wound up in Washington state (see http://wasteam.railfan.net/RFRR.html)

> The Crown from Ligonier was of the 2' variety and wound up in Washington state

I'm familiar with the current operation, and in fact I usually have the pleasure of running a few trips as engineer when I visit there. They also have acquired a second engine, and were in the process of restoring it during my last visit. That was about a year ago, so I don't know the current status.

I also rode it as a young boy back in the Ligonier days, so it brings back some memories.

There are a couple things I don't know...

1) When was the engine built? I suspect it was one of the earlier Crowns, but I haven't been able to confirm that.

2) Many of the early Crown ads in Trains and MR showed a Crown crossing a bridge. The engine was a 4-4-0 and named "Little Toot" which narrows it down to what, just about every Crown ever made except for maybe the 36" gauge versions? :) Still, the bridge looked an awful lot like the one at Idlewild, and since it wasn't far from Crown's home base, I suspect it may have been there.

I'm trying to track down a good copy of that photo, and also to confirm the location.

I found this on Youtube it's a video of the trains at Knoebels,
This is what the person has writen about it.
Len.
" This is a highlights clip from Amusement Park Trains- Volume One by Mega-Steam, LLC, the makers of JT's Mega-Steam Smoke Fluid. Featured park trains are Knoebels, PA- "Ole Smokey" coal-fired Crown 4-4-0 and their Hershell S-16 gas-powered "Pioneer Trains", which take you 1 1/2 miles through the woods... including tunnels, Dutch Wonderland- "Wonderland Express" (tunnel, bridges, ect), Bowcraft Amusements, NJ- CP Huntington, Bushkill Park, PA "Bushkill Express", Land of Make Believe, NJ- "Civil War Train", Jenkinson's Pier, NJ- CP Huntington, Smithville, NJ- CP Huntington (a nice size track layout), Wild West City, NJ- National Amusements Diesel (train robbery included), Walt Disney World RR- the engineers put on a nice show while leaving the "Toontown Fair" station...open cylinder cocks and all, WDW's Animal Kingdom- Eastern Star Express. "

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MmsIP4TaJvk