A Home For Main Line Steam

Crescent-Zephyr · **Joined:** Wed Jan 20, 2016 1:15 pm **Posts:** 1500

p51 wrote:

QJdriver wrote:

Since WHEN won't railroads hire railfans ??

When I was looking for a post-military job, I talked with a UP recruiter and he specifically told me that they don't hire train fans.
He said the reason was railfans don't stay for long once they realize it isn't as fun as they assumed it'd be.

And when was that? times change!

I've talked to many railfans that work for Class I's. Not to mention the many railfans that work for daily tourist train operations like Durango, Disney, Strasburg, Cumbres, etc.

J3a-614 · **Posted:** Wed Apr 19, 2023 10:27 am

One thing that might be worth looking at are some comments at the "Lessons On How To Run A Railroad" thread, which was mostly about Ukraine's challenges in wartime.

There were some ideas there on how to establish something like this.

Mikechoochoo wrote:

What is needed in this country is a museum with enough track to let the big locomotives stretch their legs. It could be done, but a crazy rail fan like me would have to win a billion dollar lottery to finance it. I know that there are many places in the Midwest where several abandoned right of ways form a triangle or a square. Such a project would require buying thousands of acres of land, and then reselling what was not needed with covenants on it, to prevent lawsuits from nimby’s. And to those that say such a thing is impossible, “ there are only two kinds of people in the world, those that say it can’t be done and those that find a way to do it”.

And a response:

Overmod wrote:

I am tempted to say that a more 'correct' answer is to integrate some or all the "preservation" operation with one of the PUD-real-estate plays like the one Fortress is using to justify the enormous investment in Brightline and the prospective Las Vegas HrSR line. If true higher-density high-speed traffic is not required, there may be suitable track capacity (and build quality, and maintenance) to allow large steam to run at typical excursion speed.

I would also note that the experience with the rebuilt Victorian R-class 4-6-4s in "weekend service" could easily be dusted off and promoted. Of course a proper professional support organization and probably purpose-built service vehicles and facilities would need to be put together, but a number of organizations including the T1 Trust have carefully gone through what would be needed.

Much of the overhead of the actual 'museum' preservation budget associated with excursions might fit comfortably into a comparatively small corner of the overall development budget, even if it has relatively high nominal beta...

You can read the whole thread here; take note that the quotes above are about all there is regarding a possible main line steam operation here, and they are on Page 2:

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=47260

My own two cents for location could be something from CSX; the whole of the New River line, all the way from Huntington to a connection with the Buckingham Branch should have some potential. Apparently almost all of it has been up for sale in some form for a while now; it looks like the Jacksonville crowd wants to concentrate on the Chicago-New York line and the East Coast line; they apparently don't think much of the middle, which would be the former C&O, B&O, Clinchfield, and WM lines. Heck, if I could swing it--and I know I can't--I would be tempted to consider building a whole system out of that. Yes, I know coal is on the way out for a variety of reasons, but there should still be a good level of freight traffic there, really helping to pay the bills on all the infrastructure.

Letting that much of the system go would be unthinkable in the past--but remember, modern capitalism isn't satisfied with just making money, the hedge funders and banksters and Wall Streeters want BIG MONEY (double digit return on investment, I understand), and they think the way to get it is with a 55% operating ratio. Problem is, that's probably unsustainable; look at what has happened to Union Pacific, once a crown jewel of American railroading in a period when we were in the malaise of the 1970s and Penn Central.

So many of our ills--and they aren't restricted to railroads--are because of what I call "dumbed down capitalism." In the case of railroading, it means that 55% operating ratio. Apparently the thinking is if you just get that down to there, you get those big profits! Nice and simple, easy to see, even could be a slogan!

As I think most of us would realize, the real world of business is a bit more complicated than that, at least if you're even a little bit concerned about the longer term.

I think that level of thinking and effort is too complicated and too strenuous for the modern money crowd.

Problem is, how do you take over that much of CSX and not have the modern money crowd in it? How do you raise all that dough?

Ed Kapuscinski · **Posted:** Wed Apr 19, 2023 12:29 pm

PMC wrote:

QJdriver wrote:

Since WHEN won't railroads hire railfans ?? It just ain't so, however, railroads do their best not to hire DIZZY railfans...

That's what I was told about managers, that they want people who will improve the bottom line, not someone who wants to prevent abandonments or retiring old units, or operating steam unless there is some angle to justify it. If improving the bottom line means scrapping or selling every inch of rail and going into the chocolate business (I am thinking of the former IC Industries) so be it. The crafts are probably different.

Railroads ARE businesses, aren't they? Isn't that what all responsible businesses want?

Tacky3663 · **Joined:** Wed Jun 01, 2022 9:08 pm **Posts:** 37

Crescent-Zephyr wrote:

ironeagle2006 wrote:

I would have to go out on a limb and say the Iowa Interstate and here is why. 1 already running a QJ 2-10-2 so have the experience of running steam now. 2 close to 4 major cities within 4 hours of Chicago Minn/St Paul Omaha and KC to various spots on their network. 3 located on or close to a major Interstate that being I-80 so returning passengers to starting point of a 1 way excursion is not as hard with charter buses. 4 could offer both high speed mainline and lower speed branch line runs with their line down to Peoria IL. Also could offer destination excursions to places like Starved Rock in Illinois. Lastly with the new group setting up shop in Slivis this would be the logical place for them to run on for both 3985 and 5511.

I don't think Ioawa Interstate still owns the QJ's but you're right... this will likely be the place for Mainline Steam in the middle of the USA. We need to find a place on the West Coast for the Portland engines and the 3751 to run!

3751 I believe has a partnership with Metrolink & SCRM for the future. As for 700 & 4449, I'm hopeful something may come along in the future for them to operate on as it would be a shame if they couldn't stretch their legs

Crescent-Zephyr · **Joined:** Wed Jan 20, 2016 1:15 pm **Posts:** 1500

Tacky3663 wrote:

Crescent-Zephyr wrote:

ironeagle2006 wrote:

I would have to go out on a limb and say the Iowa Interstate and here is why. 1 already running a QJ 2-10-2 so have the experience of running steam now. 2 close to 4 major cities within 4 hours of Chicago Minn/St Paul Omaha and KC to various spots on their network. 3 located on or close to a major Interstate that being I-80 so returning passengers to starting point of a 1 way excursion is not as hard with charter buses. 4 could offer both high speed mainline and lower speed branch line runs with their line down to Peoria IL. Also could offer destination excursions to places like Starved Rock in Illinois. Lastly with the new group setting up shop in Slivis this would be the logical place for them to run on for both 3985 and 5511.

I don't think Ioawa Interstate still owns the QJ's but you're right... this will likely be the place for Mainline Steam in the middle of the USA. We need to find a place on the West Coast for the Portland engines and the 3751 to run!

3751 I believe has a partnership with Metrolink & SCRM for the future. As for 700 & 4449, I'm hopeful something may come along in the future for them to operate on as it would be a shame if they couldn't stretch their legs

Good to hear about 3751. Are there any lines out West that would be good for the 4449 / 700? I really don't see them operating on BNSF anymore and I'm not familiar with what is out there. Certainly something exists in a western state!

J3a-614 · **Posted:** Thu Apr 20, 2023 6:37 pm

Crescent-Zephyr wrote:

Good to hear about 3751. Are there any lines out West that would be good for the 4449 / 700? I really don't see them operating on BNSF anymore and I'm not familiar with what is out there. Certainly something exists in a western state!

There probably are some lines; Grand Canyon would be one, Niles Canyon (in California) would be another (Cab Forwards once ran there).

But how do you get the engines there? They'd have to run or be hauled to there on UP, BNSF, or somebody. The way things are going, with the Class 1s not wanting to do anything extra, or even apparently being anxious to get out of dealing with anything rail altogether, suggests that might be problematical.

More and more you have to wonder what our capitalist system is devolving to.

Alexander D. Mitchell IV · **Posted:** Thu Apr 20, 2023 10:28 pm

From what someone in a position to say so has told me, ATSF 2926 and 3751 have open invitations to show up on the Grand Canyon Railway any time they can make the numbers work.

I'm sure that would extend to any other capable locos that want to take a Southwest vacation--NKP 765? N&W 611? SP 4449? (We can fantasize about UP steam, but I don't have enough booze to see that happening.)

Tacky3663 · **Joined:** Wed Jun 01, 2022 9:08 pm **Posts:** 37

Alexander D. Mitchell IV wrote:

From what someone in a position to say so has told me, ATSF 2926 and 3751 have open invitations to show up on the Grand Canyon Railway any time they can make the numbers work.

I'm sure that would extend to any other capable locos that want to take a Southwest vacation--NKP 765? N&W 611? SP 4449? (We can fantasize about UP steam, but I don't have enough booze to see that happening.)

The pipe dream for UP Steam will happen in Cheyenne once 3985 is finished

Alexander D. Mitchell IV · **Posted:** Sat Apr 22, 2023 6:52 pm

Tacky3663 wrote:

The pipe dream for UP Steam will happen in Cheyenne once 3985 is finished

Not if 3985 is no longer UP-owned/operated.

(At least if UP doesn't revert to a double standard about its alleged policies toward "foreign steam".........)

Tacky3663 · **Joined:** Wed Jun 01, 2022 9:08 pm **Posts:** 37

Alexander D. Mitchell IV wrote:

Tacky3663 wrote:

The pipe dream for UP Steam will happen in Cheyenne once 3985 is finished

Not if 3985 is no longer UP-owned/operated.

(At least if UP doesn't revert to a double standard about its alleged policies toward "foreign steam".........)

I know people at RRHMA who have mentioned that UP has stated that they want to have an event in Cheyenne with all 3 steam engines and are willing to give special permission for 3985 to get there

J3a-614 · **Posted:** Thu Feb 22, 2024 8:26 pm

Just thought it might be time to bump this thread up.

One item of note is how Union Pacific was part of this thread, and how things have since changed.

And it looks like someone might be attempting an operation along these lines in Virginia. I do wish them the best of luck.

In my opinion, one thing that this outfit will have to do more of--and they likely have this planned in some form--is using these steam trains to link travelers to various attractions by rail. It helps that the former C&O in Virginia (and West Virginia) is among the most scenic lines in the east.

One thing that's interesting is that it apparently took state (government) ownership (YIKES!! SOCIALISM!!) to make this possible at all.

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=47904

Ed Kapuscinski · **Posted:** Fri Feb 23, 2024 3:09 pm

You know, with the recent news about NS, someone might be able to buy the Pittsburgh Line in a few years.

Now is the time to go figure out the next meme stonk and head to the moon.

A Home For Main Line Steam

Who is online