ALCO FA cabs in preservation. What is the current status of

Thundarr · **Joined:** Sat Aug 14, 2021 9:10 pm **Posts:** 13

Clear, concrete, and publicly available information from ORHF would have provided information to those who would lead a preservation and fundraising effort and potential donors. Additionally, starting communications at the beginning of the process would give as much time as possible to organize and respond effectively.[/quote]

Yeah, the experts on social media are not happy about how nobody said anything til it was too late. I know of at least one person who asked about saving some components as soon as word got out and was essentially told "it's already begun and we're too busy" even though a quick peek from public streets could see the scrappers hadn't shown up yet.

PMC · **Joined:** Sat Oct 17, 2015 5:55 pm **Posts:** 2304

Nova55 wrote:

There is a 16-244 in Canada.

I reported this tidbit to the group restoring the PA in Texas and received a "meh" as a reply, they would rather use a 12-251 because it would be easier. I guess that, not everywhere, accuracy is its own justification.

Ken Middlebrook · **Posted:** Fri Mar 01, 2024 8:09 am

Thomas Cornillie wrote:

SP&S 866 and the other equipment that was scrapped. The 2022 Form 990 for the Oregon Rail Heritage Foundation (available at: https://beta.candid.org/profile/8384817) indicates that the organization has 15 officers and directors. I would expect that the decision to scrap this equipment came after multiple board meetings and formal resolutions. Additionally, the private ownership of SP&S 866 might have necessitated involving counsel to take adverse possession. Considering the overall context, I would expect that scrapping came at a net cost to the organization.

This is a reminder of the many considerations that an organization must answer BEFORE agreeing to provide storage of privately owned equipment. It is this very reason, why many simply say “no”.

Nova55 · **Joined:** Thu Apr 12, 2007 8:09 pm **Posts:** 564

PMC wrote:

Nova55 wrote:

There is a 16-244 in Canada.

I reported this tidbit to the group restoring the PA in Texas and received a "meh" as a reply, they would rather use a 12-251 because it would be easier. I guess that, not everywhere, accuracy is its own justification.

Going for an operational restoration, I would probably tend to agree with going the 12-251 route, as 244 parts are just going to dwindle in the coming years.

PMC · **Joined:** Sat Oct 17, 2015 5:55 pm **Posts:** 2304

Nova55 wrote:

Going for an operational restoration, I would probably tend to agree with going the 12-251 route, as 244 parts are just going to dwindle in the coming years.

Well, except that, as was noted in the E thread, there's still a big difference between "in operable condition" and "in service". I doubt that those guys would be starting it up and running it, let alone putting serious hours on it, enough to worry about wear on power assemblies, etc.

PCook · **Joined:** Sat Jul 02, 2005 7:16 am **Posts:** 2022

Trust me on this, a 16-244 will not fit in the PA4 without extensive re-modification. The traction motor blower for the front truck is in the way. I talked with Chris MacDermot some years ago about the changes he and Norm Anderson made to these units, and that discussion took several hours. That interview also covered the 12-244 transplant in D&H 17. See the article in Classic Trains Winter 2017 for that story. I wanted to set up a discussion with Chris at RMNE a few years back, but health issues prevented him from traveling. At that time there might have been a chance of getting him, Gus Negus, and Bruce Sterzing all together.

A few of us out here actually do contact the people who designed a project before we write an article about it.

Remember when.............

PCook · **Joined:** Sat Jul 02, 2005 7:16 am **Posts:** 2022

Alco 12-251E for sale on eBay for $275,000, as of today 3/3/24:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/235374145807?i ... BM6qHe0sBj

Disclaimer: Posted for info only, I have nothing to do with this auction.

PC

PCook · **Joined:** Sat Jul 02, 2005 7:16 am **Posts:** 2022

And here is a 12-251 for $25:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/155283212543?i ... R5SW3tPAYw

Disclaimer: Posted for info only, I have nothing to do with this auction.

PC

PMC · **Joined:** Sat Oct 17, 2015 5:55 pm **Posts:** 2304

The thing is, they are restoring it as a Santa Fe unit, and the entire time it was a Santa Fe unit it had a 16-244, up until it was stricken from the roster and traded into GE in the late 1960s. And because almost everything back there was pulled out and sold for scrap when the unit was sitting on the ground in Mexico, all of that will likely need to be fabricated new anyway, including the traction motor blowers. Accuracy is its own justification.

PCook · **Joined:** Sat Jul 02, 2005 7:16 am **Posts:** 2022

Here is how they looked originally.

PC

Overmod · **Joined:** Thu May 24, 2012 1:37 pm **Posts:** 2239

Quote:

"And here is a 12-251 for $25:

But that's O scale. If you scaled it to full size, it would be $2,764,800.

Alexander D. Mitchell IV · **Posted:** Sun Mar 03, 2024 11:15 pm

Overmod wrote:

Quote:

"And here is a 12-251 for $25:

But that's O scale. If you scaled it to full size, it would be $2,764,800.

If the math worked this way, Z scale models would be dirt cheap.

Overmod · **Joined:** Thu May 24, 2012 1:37 pm **Posts:** 2239

Quote:

"If the math worked this way, Z scale models would be dirt cheap."

But you'd still need $10,648,000 of them to fill the engine bay. Even if they were 3 cents apiece you'd still find the $275,000 a better deal. Likely a better-running one, too.

PCook · **Joined:** Sat Jul 02, 2005 7:16 am **Posts:** 2022

Maybe or maybe not. That unused spare engine is possibly from USCG POLAR-class icebreakers which suffered catastrophic engine failures in the early 2000s, resulting in one ship being taken out of service as a parts donor for the others. Proceed with caution.

https://maritime-executive.com/features ... -polar-sea

PC

AlcoC420 · **Joined:** Wed Dec 15, 2010 8:17 pm **Posts:** 262

[quote="PCook"]Maybe or maybe not. That unused spare engine is possibly from USCG POLAR-class icebreakers which suffered catastrophic engine failures in the early 2000s, resulting in one ship being taken out of service as a parts donor for the others. Proceed with caution.

https://maritime-executive.com/features ... -polar-sea

The engine in the Ebay add is a 12 cylinder and the Polar Star and Polar Sea use the 16 cylinder "F" series rated at 3,000 hp.

There are 2 engine generator sets in the photo and these were offered several years ago for a lot less money.

ALCO FA cabs in preservation. What is the current status of

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