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 Post subject: Final Coal Fired Trip on the Durango & Silverton is Tomorrow
PostPosted: Fri Mar 22, 2024 10:28 pm 

Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2006 1:45 am
Posts: 366
Location: Skagway, Alaska
March 23, 2024.

Roundhouse board said "run until out of coal". The loader put the last bucket into the tender of the 481 this afternoon.

It's been fun.

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 Post subject: Re: Final Coal Fired Trip on the Durango & Silverton is Tomo
PostPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2024 1:48 pm 

Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2016 1:15 pm
Posts: 1500
End of an era. I wish they could have kept 1 or 2 for winter and special occasions but I understand that it makes more sense to have them all available year round.


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 Post subject: Re: Final Coal Fired Trip on the Durango & Silverton is Tomo
PostPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2024 3:50 pm 

Joined: Thu Oct 24, 2019 11:05 pm
Posts: 142
Is there a fuel for the day after tomorros?


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 Post subject: Re: Final Coal Fired Trip on the Durango & Silverton is Tomo
PostPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2024 3:53 pm 

Joined: Fri Jul 24, 2009 5:51 pm
Posts: 209
Location: Massachusetts
mmi16 wrote:
Is there a fuel for the day after tomorros?


All of the other steam locomotives on the Durango & Silverton Narrow Gauge Railroad have been converted to oil firing. Once the coal pile is exhausted, the 481, the last of the coal-burners will get that same conversion.

/Kevin Madore


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 Post subject: Re: Final Coal Fired Trip on the Durango & Silverton is Tomo
PostPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2024 4:19 pm 

Joined: Sun Apr 02, 2017 3:13 am
Posts: 129
Coal smells better than oil.


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 Post subject: Re: Final Coal Fired Trip on the Durango & Silverton is Tomo
PostPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2024 5:49 pm 

Joined: Thu Oct 24, 2019 11:05 pm
Posts: 142
kew wrote:
Coal smells better than oil.

Never featured coal smelled all that good - during my childhood many neighbors homes were heated by coal - recall a smell I didn't like when the winds stopped blowing it away.

Oil, diesel and gasoline all have varying levels of disagreeable smell.


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 Post subject: Re: Final Coal Fired Trip on the Durango & Silverton is Tomo
PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 3:05 pm 

Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2016 1:15 pm
Posts: 1500
I've definitely gotten some bad cinders in my eye at durango in the past - there are some positives about riding behind oil burners and they sound the same working up the mountain.

There is still something very special about knowing that the fireman is shoveling coal and that the locomotives are operating just the way they always have on that line.


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 Post subject: Re: Final Coal Fired Trip on the Durango & Silverton is Tomo
PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 4:15 pm 

Joined: Sun Sep 05, 2004 9:48 am
Posts: 1561
Location: Byers, Colorado
Crescent-Zephyr wrote:
the locomotives are operating just the way they always have on that line.


Yes they are. It goes without saying that the railroad was blamed most unfairly for a fire clear on the other side of the highway, where any wind strong enough to carry cinders that far would cool them sufficiently to mitigate the fire risk... while pretty much everything close to the track had been burned up long ago.

The professional do-gooders in the Durango area are just shooting themselves in the feet every time they aim another restriction at their biggest tourist attraction. Wonder how long it will be before somebody figures out that oil burners can start fires, too...

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Ask what you can do for your locomotive,

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 Post subject: Re: Final Coal Fired Trip on the Durango & Silverton is Tomo
PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 5:58 pm 

Joined: Tue Sep 14, 2004 7:52 am
Posts: 2573
Location: Strasburg, PA
mmi16 wrote:
kew wrote:
Coal smells better than oil.

Never featured coal smelled all that good - during my childhood many neighbors homes were heated by coal - recall a smell I didn't like when the winds stopped blowing it away.

Oil, diesel and gasoline all have varying levels of disagreeable smell.
Depends on the coal. Coal on the Colorado lines is delicious to smell. The coal burned where I worked always struck me as an acrid, nasty odor that burned my sinuses.


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 Post subject: Re: Final Coal Fired Trip on the Durango & Silverton is Tomo
PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 5:59 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:51 pm
Posts: 11501
Location: Somewhere east of Prescott, AZ along the old Santa Fe "Prescott & Eastern"
Image

Quote:
Between Jerry's camera, another "official" photo and videographer, and then myself, I don't think any of them knew which camera to look at.
But the crew of the last regularly scheduled, coal-powered train on the Rio Grande's Silverton Branch and other Durango and Silverton employees gathered on the pilot of 481 to wish her farewell for her journey to Cascade.
After arrival, the fire was dropped Saturday afternoon, ending 143 years of coal power in Durango.


https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=73 ... 9883039484


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 Post subject: Re: Final Coal Fired Trip on the Durango & Silverton is Tomo
PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 7:17 pm 

Joined: Fri Apr 26, 2013 5:56 pm
Posts: 412
Location: Ontario, Canada.
Best wishes to them going forward.
Does anyone have any pics or information on the burner designs? Perhaps that has been talked about on here before? Thanx.
One assumes they have secured a good supply of waste oil. Can they blend in diesel if required?
https://www.trains.com/trn/news-reviews ... now-train/


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 Post subject: Re: Final Coal Fired Trip on the Durango & Silverton is Tomo
PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2024 1:12 am 

Joined: Wed Nov 21, 2018 1:09 am
Posts: 7
Great Western wrote:
One assumes they have secured a good supply of waste oil. Can they blend in diesel if required?


Waste/recycled oil can typically be easily sourced from a variety of recycling companies if there's one within reasonable trucking distance of you. Waste oil from restaurants, mechanics, and other such places can also be acquired directly in some cases as long as you're mindful of what you get and at least do a basic screen filter of it before you put it in the tender. Even if oil has to be trucked in from a ways away, it will still very likely be cheaper than coal has been anymore these days unless I'm mistaken.

In most cases, burners don't care very much what you put through them as long as it's combustible within a range. Diesel is combustible (not flammable) in a very similar area as oil is so it can readily be mixed in even at high ratios. It just changes the firing behavior a little bit for the fireman holding the valve handle. On a well tuned firing system, you can kinda tell how thick or thin your fuel is by how it behaves. What you notice more often is when you get a slug of water or something that doesn't mix well with the rest of your fuel like hydraulic oil. Then your fire can change real quick on you and you better be quick to catch it before it either blows out or smokes you out. Though most often, it only causes the fire to sputter a bit. I'm aware of an engine that once had probably about 40% diesel in it's tender after a recycled oil delivery got unexpectedly delayed. Fired just fine, though a bit more expensive.


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 Post subject: Re: Final Coal Fired Trip on the Durango & Silverton is Tomo
PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2024 7:59 am 

Joined: Fri Apr 26, 2013 5:56 pm
Posts: 412
Location: Ontario, Canada.
Thank you Mr. Williams,
That is interesting
I should preface this by saying, I was not trying to second-guess the D&S folks. They are experienced professionals and know what they are doing. I just find this an interesting topic. The conversion to oil firing is a major shift for D&S and it is interesting to understand the inside story. There must be some "cultural" changes happening within the shop and operating staffs to re-fit the locomotives, and train staff for the best operating practices. All quite interesting, especially for other operations that could take this path.
A lot of this has been discussed on here before. This railway is in an area where there should be a supply of waste oil from automotive, truck, perhaps agriculture. Having worked in these areas in the past, there will be a variety of oils that can be blended to make good burner fuel. As Mr. Williams said, operating crews will have to manage varying conditions at times, but that is likely no different from working coal.
Read recently about the Imperial Japanese Navy in WW2. It was using some sweet crude oil directly from the fields around Java, etc., firing the super-heated boilers in its warships. Some of this oil was of a higher volatility than others and required special handling. Mind you, D&S should not have 16-inch armor piercing shells raining down on them during operation -- one hopes!
Also, from a private conversation, it seems D&S is using conventional U.S style burner systems mounted beneath the throat sheets. For sure -- why re-invent the wheel! Pictures would be of interest.
Again, best wishes to them for safe and successful operation for many years to come.


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 Post subject: Re: Final Coal Fired Trip on the Durango & Silverton is Tomo
PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2024 10:10 pm 

Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2016 1:15 pm
Posts: 1500
Great Western wrote:
I just find this an interesting topic. The conversion to oil firing is a major shift for D&S and it is interesting to understand the inside story. There must be some "cultural" changes happening within the shop and operating staffs to re-fit the locomotives, and train staff for the best operating practices. All quite interesting, especially for other operations that could take this path.


There wasn't a "cultural" change - the Durango & Silverton started a pretty major fire. Which is sad, the D&S is an extremely historic operation and one of the only places where you could see that many coal-fired locomotives under steam at a time. But the good news is, steam still lives!


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 Post subject: Re: Final Coal Fired Trip on the Durango & Silverton is Tomo
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2024 11:33 am 

Joined: Fri Apr 26, 2013 5:56 pm
Posts: 412
Location: Ontario, Canada.
Crescent-Zephyr wrote:
Great Western wrote:
I just find this an interesting topic. The conversion to oil firing is a major shift for D&S and it is interesting to understand the inside story. There must be some "cultural" changes happening within the shop and operating staffs to re-fit the locomotives, and train staff for the best operating practices. All quite interesting, especially for other operations that could take this path.


There wasn't a "cultural" change - the Durango & Silverton started a pretty major fire. Which is sad, the D&S is an extremely historic operation and one of the only places where you could see that many coal-fired locomotives under steam at a time. But the good news is, steam still lives!


The "cultural change" refers to changing from coal to oil and the retraining and rethinking of operations and shop work.


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