Let's consider what factors need be available for such an event:

1. A large enough venue to house it.
2. Friendly track close by for excursions.
3. Sponsor with insurance in place for existing intensive operation.
4. Access to major transportation arteries.
5. Adequate visitor infrastructure nearby.
6. Available resources to produce the event.

The wild card here is the transportation of steam locomotives from wherever to the venue chosen. Getting mainlines to buy in, or AMTRAK sponsorship for ferry moves? Dead in consist? Here's where we need to get some real work done.

I have no doubt failed to include some critical conditions in the short list above. feel free to add to it.

Let's say we limit it to roundhouses or other large railroad maintenence sites in or near urban centers with friendly shortlines or institution owned trackage close by.

Baltimore
Sacramento
Spencer (friendly trackage?)
Scranton
Altoona (friendly trackage?)
Savannah, once the connection is built.

Anybody else should be on this list?

Dave

In reading all of these posts I think the point being missed is this was to be a celebration of something that was a major contributor to making this nation what it is today. It was not just an event for the preservationists. Quite a few organizations had put considerable effort and money into this event. Personally I would hate to see this anniversary go by without any recognition.

Perhaps it is time to rethink the size of the event and ask CSX and Baltimore to join the B&O Museum in a smaller scale project that can celebrate the event and salvage some of the work that has already been done. It would have to make some money to help with the roof replacement and also give the CSX and city some reason to get onboard. It was obvious to me when I saw the first pictures of the fallen roof the fair would be canceled and it is obvious to me now the staff at B&O will not have time to do both a celebration and repair the damage. Therefore other groups will have to pitch in and help if anything is going to happen.

Of course time is short and if anything is going to happen the work needs to start now. Moving the event to another city is not going to work with the possible exception of something along the original B&O mainline near Baltimore. If you or your organization have any suggestions or are willing to help I suggest you respectfully present them to the museum and allow them to make the final decision. It is also important to not get your feelings hurt if they do not choose any or all of your ideas.

John Bohon

jhbohon@yahoo.com

No Message

St. Louis/Kirkwood?

Union, Illinois?

Chicago?

Chattanooga?

lner4472@bcpl.net

> St. Louis/Kirkwood?

> Union, Illinois?

> Chicago?

> Chattanooga?

You ever consider Austin,TX?

1. Friendly shortline
2. Two Class One connections
3. Steam tourist railroad in host city

kbcotton@flash.net

> Perhaps it is time to rethink the size of
> the event and ask CSX and Baltimore to join
> the B&O Museum in a smaller scale
> project that can celebrate the event and
> salvage some of the work that has already
> been done. It would have to make some money
> to help with the roof replacement and also
> give the CSX and city some reason to get
> onboard. It was obvious to me when I saw the
> first pictures of the fallen roof the fair
> would be canceled and it is obvious to me
> now the staff at B&O will not have time
> to do both a celebration and repair the
> damage. Therefore other groups will have to
> pitch in and help if anything is going to
> happen.

> Of course time is short and if anything is
> going to happen the work needs to start now.
> Moving the event to another city is not
> going to work with the possible exception of
> something along the original B&O
> mainline near Baltimore. If you or your
> organization have any suggestions or are
> willing to help I suggest you respectfully
> present them to the museum and allow them to
> make the final decision. It is also
> important to not get your feelings hurt if
> they do not choose any or all of your ideas.

John, I am not an "insider" at the B&O Museum. However, I can tell you that even in the wake of the roof collapse I gave the Fair a chance of happening--I was publicly telling everyone "50-50". The paid professionals of the Museum--the ones facing furlough or layoffs because of loss of Museum income--ultimately had to make the decision based on what they know, including every factor from ticket sales to participating locos.

I know many of the parties that have the spirit and desire to keep this Fair going; they've been flooding my inbox for the past two weeks. However, I must duly note that the Museum "insiders" that I know that were strongly in favor of pressing on with the Fair did not (as far as I know) have an opportunity to present their case to the management. I have heard of two volunteers specifically locked out of one volunteer gathering this weekend--apparently because they were not high enough on the volunteer list in seniority or whatever.

There isn't any really charitable way for me to state the following opinion, but it's one formed from ten years of working in the Museum's shadow and helping them indirectly: The B&O Museum's management has never taken well to outside ideas or suggestions since becoming independent in the late 1980s. Whether a good or bad idea, an outside group pursuing the salvage of the Fair--even for the benefit of the Museum--would be rejected, as much as for practical reasons as because it wasn't management's idea.

I will note that this "attitude" of the B&O Museum is hardly unique to the B&O Museum; I have encountered this "insider" culture at many other operations large and small, and I have seen some nasty frictions that have arisen from the conflicts between management, underlings, and outside contributors. (Talk to the staff at state-run or Federal railroad sites someday--and watch enthusiastic foamers become numb bureaucrats.....) The difference is that the ones that open the doors or minds to outsiders get MY help; the cliquish ones don't.

lner4472@bcpl.net

> The best tort reform would be juries that do not continually provide ever escalating awards and judges that make good use of vexatious litigant rulings, otherwise we'll be continuing to bandaid a hemorrage, while feeding the patient anti-coagulants.

Otherwise I will continue to dream about (admittedly fantasy)day that the ABA is treated as it should be- a subject of investigation under the RICO law, a monopoly under antitrust and an organization engaging in economic terrorism under any of the new laws.

Funny thing about law school-you get the equivalent of doctorate-but for most of the nation's history, most lawyers, even the Chief Justice of the Supreme court saw no need for formal legal education.

Superheater@rrmail.com

> John, I am not an "insider" at the
> B&O Museum. However, I can tell you that
> even in the wake of the roof collapse I gave
> the Fair a chance of happening--I was
> publicly telling everyone "50-50".
> The paid professionals of the Museum--the
> ones facing furlough or layoffs because of
> loss of Museum income--ultimately had to
> make the decision based on what they know,
> including every factor from ticket sales to
> participating locos.

> I know many of the parties that have the
> spirit and desire to keep this Fair going;
> they've been flooding my inbox for the past
> two weeks. However, I must duly note that
> the Museum "insiders" that I know
> that were strongly in favor of pressing on
> with the Fair did not (as far as I know)
> have an opportunity to present their case to
> the management. I have heard of two
> volunteers specifically locked out of one
> volunteer gathering this weekend--apparently
> because they were not high enough on the
> volunteer list in seniority or whatever.

> There isn't any really charitable way for me
> to state the following opinion, but it's one
> formed from ten years of working in the
> Museum's shadow and helping them indirectly:
> The B&O Museum's management has never
> taken well to outside ideas or suggestions
> since becoming independent in the late
> 1980s. Whether a good or bad idea, an
> outside group pursuing the salvage of the
> Fair--even for the benefit of the
> Museum--would be rejected, as much as for
> practical reasons as because it wasn't
> management's idea.

> I will note that this "attitude"
> of the B&O Museum is hardly unique to
> the B&O Museum; I have encountered this
> "insider" culture at many other
> operations large and small, and I have seen
> some nasty frictions that have arisen from
> the conflicts between management,
> underlings, and outside contributors. (Talk
> to the staff at state-run or Federal
> railroad sites someday--and watch
> enthusiastic foamers become numb
> bureaucrats.....) The difference is that the
> ones that open the doors or minds to
> outsiders get MY help; the cliquish ones
> don't.

I have been involved in quite a few orginizations both large and small. Like you I seek those that accept outsiders and have seen the damage caused by to much ego. I also have some idea of the effort it takes to put on an event such as this and to repair the damage I saw in the pictures. I think it says a lot for the people with the most to lose, namely their jobs, that they would put the museum first and canceled the fair because they thought it was the right thing to do. What I was trying to say in my last paragraph was that for anything to come of this celebration everybody must check their ego at the door.

jhbohon@yahoo.com

Dresden.....May 16-18, 2003

The 12th Annual Steam Locomotive Festival (Dampflokfest)

I've seen as many as 35 steam locos here. It's the best gathering of steam locos I've ever attended and I've been here three times.

-Jim Herron

Dresdener Dampflokfest
hrvideo@mindspring.com