I don't know, they did look sharp when they were clean, especially when sporting an array of Nathan five chimes and warning strobes. Those in the West had the advantage of some really colorful classic steam and diesel paint schemes - SP Daylight, ATSF War Bonnet, GN orange and green, etc. The South had SR green and ACL yellow and purple. Growing up in N. Ohio in the early '70's, we briefly had the EL maroon, yellow and grey, but mostly PC black, N&W black, and B&O/C&O dark blue and yellow lettering. The advent of the Chessie System vermillion, yellow and blue was a real splash of color in an area that generally lacked that sort of thing.

There are few fans who are generally more purist about accurately displaying preserved pieces than I. That said, really the only reason a T hog is in Baltimore at all is because of Mr. Rowland's connection to Chessie System and the B&O Museum. One could also argue the peripheral connection to Stregel (sp?) Salvage, where the 2100 and 2101 were rescued from. If there were only one preserved, I would argue that it belonged under cover, in classic RDG freight paint, at the State museum in Strasburg. Since four exist, having one briefly painted for one of it's high-profile rolls that might attract positive public attention and visitors is something to be considered.

I argee with Paul,
I'm a member of the Friends of the Railroad Museum of Pennsylvania , And the Reading Company T-1 would be a nice pice of rolling stock to have there. We have the Reading yard goat 1251 and having the T-1 would be nice. The only part of T-1's we have are a few head lights.

It should come back in Pennsylvania where it belongs.

Len.

Len;

What I said was, that if there were only ONE T-1 in existence, it should be inside at Strasburg. Really, you SHOULD have one, and if Mr. Muller decides that he no longer wants to deal with the '02, then hopefully it would come your way. However, I really see no need at this point for the '01 to leave Baltimore if something can be done to stop the deterioration. It does have a connection to Chessie/CSX, so it's not totally out of place there. A number of preserved and/or excursion engines have such a mixed up history that there may be no one logical place for them to be.

I have mulled this over regarding a piece in the Steamtown collection, Danville and Mt. Morris ten wheeler #304. It began life as a NKP loco, in fact the oldest existing NKP locomotive. Then it was sold to the Akron, Canton, and Youngstown (and is the ONLY existing AC&Y steam locomotive), and then to the D&Mt.M. It ran the longest on the D&Mt.M., I believe 27 years. So, where would it make the most sense for it to be? Academic argument, since Steamtown is not about to give up one of it's few totally U. S. Steam locos. Reasonable arguments could be made that it belongs either in Bellevue, OH, Akron, OH, Danville, NY, or Scranton. When I visited Steamtown in '96, I was told the plan was to restore it as an AC&Y locomotive there. I have no idea if anything has been done towards that end.

There are a lot of preserved locomotives that have strange histories like that. Some, like UP 844, have run far longer in excursion service than they ever did in day-to-day revenue service, although doing so for the same railroad is highly unusual.

So, as much as Strasburg deserves a T-1, getting the '01 is not what I really had in mind. Maybe the 2100, depending on what happens with it's current wanderings?

Hi Paul,
Well for 2102 ever going to strasburg, that will never happen, because Mr. Muller is a Memeber the RCT&HS and before it would go strasburg, it would be at the Reading Company Museum.

I was told this by Muller him self that if R&N would fold up, the T-1 would belong to the RCT&HS.

Len.

Assuming that this is true (i.e. Muller doesn't change his mind, no ugly battles over an estate or corporation monies ensue, etc.)..........

And this is a problem....................... HOW?

Stuff a 90% operable T1 in a static museum isolated from Reading track with a shortage of tracks on which to display everything, probably not to run again...........

Or put a 90% operable T1 in a museum in its "home town" on "home rails" with the potential of future operation with a group that seems to have a decent history of getting stuff operable.............

And there's still at least one other T1 to "play vulture" with and stalk, provided its current operator doesn't mangle it beyond recognition......

Tell me, um............ was there actually an issue being discussed here? Like, something that can actually be *debated*? <:-)

Another problem arises here. Since RDG 2100 & 2102 are both capable of steaming, placing them in the RMPA buries them alive. Policy at the Museum, if I understand it correctly, is that the steam locomotives will never be fired again. 2101 is already (more or less) condemned to that fate, ergo, that would be the RDG T1 to be stuffed and mounted rather than the others. I think it's a dubious question that 2124 will ever be fired again, and she's a permanent member of the Steamtown collection, and untouchable. I would much rather 2101 at RMPA, in RDG paint, (if they have the room for her) than in AFT paint which says nothing about her true operational life. That said, I am grateful for her continued preservation in any museum collection.

You folks are of course welcome to kick this can around forever if you like but here's a little reality check;

1. The chances of the 2101 ever leaving the B&O's collection are so close to none that discussing other homes is a silly waste of time/ink. 2. As the locomotive was presented to them, via Mr. Hays T. Watkins, in its AFT livery at Mr. Watkins request it will no doubt stay in that livery. Hopefully the museum will get sufficiently recovered and on top of its game plan to not only get her repainted but not allowed to deterioate again to the sad shape she's in today!!

IMHO-Ross Rowland

I think if there is any real effort,fudraising or otherwise for the preservation/operation of one of the T-1s the obvious choice needs to be the 2100. It has lots of tube time, it runs (I've seen and heard it) and its owner has,albiet rumoured,financial problems.

Here's my overly simplistic multi-step plan;

1. Raise Funds

2.Move it back to Pennsylvania

3.Pull out the hokey oil burner and the
drop in bunker in the tender,replace grates
and repair any firebox damage or bent main rods
it supposedly has.

4.Strip off and paint offensive mettalic red wherever found....

I would love for there to be a way for the 2100 to come home, that way the Reading fans wouldn't have to feel like us west coast types had come over and drug the Liberty Bell down the road with our pickup trucks....

Cheers, Dave

What you propose Hillcrest has at least some chance (however slim) of happenning. The 2100 has not moved an inch since it arrived in its present location many months ago.
Where the legal situation stands with the list of unpaid vendors from the ill fated 2006 Tacoma operation is not clear. Sources I trust and believe to be knowledgeable tell me it's only a matter of time until she goes on the auction block to help offset the bills. I have personally seen copies of some of the larger invoices which total in the mid six figures and include creditors such as CNRR,BNSF, CPRR and Tacoma Rail. How long these and others will wait before beginning legal action is an open question. There is also the possibility that one of the principals involved (a wealthy Canadian insurance man) could pay off the creditors and assume exclusive title to the engine???
Within the realities of both the relative condition of the engine and todays marketplace I'd be VERY surprised if it attracted any bids above as- is, where is, net scrap value. I'd guess that her on location net scrap value at todays scrap steel prices is somewhere around $50,000.
Therefore, if a notice appears of an upcoming auction then Hillcrests idea could work if a group of Rdg. lovers could get together say $100,000 and beat out the scappers at auction and have some funds left over to pay to store her a while to have time to put together a longer range game plan.
That's more feasible then wasting time fantasizeing about the 2101.
IMHO-Ross Rowland

Also, in regard to the original subject, I vote for the AFT#1 paint scheme, for of the three AFT locomotives I thought 2101's colors were the the most tastefully applied, and it would also make it the only former AFT engine still "flying the colors"....

Cheers, Dave

Ross mentioned earlier a mistake was not establishing an endowment to care for the 2101. If B&O does endowments perhaps establishing one now would be the best way to get 2101 painted. I see no particular reason to move the locomotive. Though there is little to no chance it will run again that will certainly be the case for 2101 or any of the other T-1's if they go to RRMPA. Taking any potential operating engine out of the shrinking pool will only put us out of bussiness faster and should be looked at carefully no matter the engine. The 2101 is protected and safe. Now if we can get her looking more presentable I will be satisfied regardless of the color of the paint. Personally I would donate to an endowment for 2101.

John Bohon

As for AFT #1/RDG #2101, I have a novel idea (I'll duck the flame throwers). Since it's been painted for the AFT the past 27 years, how about painting it in it's Chessie Steam Special paint for a few years. I'm willing to bet that there are more than a few 30 and 40 somethings who remember seeing and riding behind it as kids in '77 and '78, and just might have the light bulb go on driving by and seeing it in that paint and go in for a visit. (Even though I went through the AFT when it was in Cleveland, the '01 was hidden at Collingwood while it was in town. Probably true for many places the AFT displayed.) Then the next time it's due for paint, do the RDG freight scheme. Just a thought. Now a word from those who would like to ream me a new one![/quote]


I'll duck a bigger one, paint each side in a different scheme?(ducking quickly)

I may be in the minority here, but allow me the following:

I am not a Reading fan and have no vested interest in the B&O Museum or in any of the T1s that survive today.

For many reasons too numerous to mention here, I am a huge fan of the American Freedom Train and all things associated with it. Simple reason is that when I saw the AFT in April of 1976, 4449 was the first steam engine that I had ever seen that was actually operable (read, not stuffed and mounted). As a youngster of 13 years old, I am forever grateful that my parents allowed me to miss a day of school to see the AFT.

For many of us, the American Freedom Train is arguably the most significant railroading event to happen in our lifetime. Think about it. A train filled with some of our nation's most significant artifacts touring the country behind a steam locomotive over nearly a two year period, visiting every one of the 48 continental states in an era where steam simply did not happen outside of tourist operations (props to the UP and the 8444, though).

Fortunately, all three of the steam locomotives that served at the point of the AFT are still with us. T&P 610 rests in Texas in T&P livery, SP 4449 is in Portland (and I don't need to tell you more about her!) and AFT #1 (2101) is at the B&O Museum. As we all know, the paint job on AFT #1/2101 is not the best. But, considering the challenges faced by the folks in Baltimore, I am okay with that.

My good friend Kevin Gillespie (we have GOT to link up someday) has said the AFT #1 will be repainted in her AFT colors sometime in the future. I trust his word.

Rejoice that the B&O Museum has decided to do so! As already mentioned, there are several T1s out there that could be restored to full Reading livery. I challenge you to name one piece of equipment from the American Freedom Train that is still wearing the r/w/b. Why not the 2101? I think she serves as a reminder to a whole new generation of fans of a special time when steam made a comeback during our nation's bicentennial.

And there is nothing wrong with that.

Respectfully,
Burlington John Lewis
Palmyra, Missouri

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AmericanFreedomTrain/

I'll second that motion John!!!
Ross Rowland

I'm with you John....I was 14 and my trip to see the AFT was a school field trip!!! Thanks to our history teacher, Mr. Brittain....

Cheers, Dave