"Green" segment. What is it that you're referring to?

Green Segment= that portion of the population that is "into" anything perceived as being good for the earth's enviroment and into animals, plants and technology that seems to embrace enviromental issues. Not that that is a bad thing, but that segment is often mislead--non the less, they do seem to enjoy going to natural history museums that feature interactive displays and "activism" issues. If one could teach them how enviromentaly friendly railraods are compared to most other forms of transportation, maybe we could "snag" some of them!???
Hmmm.
S'
David D.

speaking soley for myself. my Dad is a member of the Beaver Lawrence RRHS. Mom and Dad had been members since they moved back to Beaver Falls. this fine group has a B&O Tower they are preserving. A couple years ago they bought a P&LE Station. Included in their rolling stock collection is a PRR N5C they are restoring. When Mom died, Dad trnsfered her membership to me. In the following year, between monthly meetings, a great train show, and a car show, all I attended was the train show. Why? I work 21 turn, all three shifts,7 days a week, two off, and only one weekend off amonth. I'm either at work, on my way to, or sleeping because i'm on midnights. I'm only an hour away. My lack of particaption sure isn't from lack of interest.

Dave,
We have several in our organization that are in simular circumstance. However, their limited participation is still appreciated. We can't all be retired.

We have some older folks who only actively participate a few times a year at Christmas Trains, etc. and the annual meeting. Their limited participation still helps the organization. Do what you can.

Bill

Sure!

But I don't think the real problem is convincing folks of railroads' environmental friendliness -- that's easy enough to do, despite railroads' firm integration into our dirty smokestack past. Just show them a 100 year old streetcar, and they get it.

The real challenge is convincing them of railroads' relevance. Railroads are, by and large, invisible to the general population unless they live in a community where highway traffic has become unbearable. As for freight, ask any Muggle what the busiest year in the history of freight railroading was, and the smarter ones will mumble something about World War II. They certainly will not guess that the industry breaks its own record nearly every year since the Staggers Act passed.

So how do we convey all that?

You are right, Mr. Hees. I could not agree more. We discredit ourselves and our forefathers too often for saving "too much". It was all important then.

It is not a unique problem to railroad artifacts that current generations have no frame of reference for what we display. Yet, one can go see an exhibit on ancient Rome or a medieval court and still come away educated and entertained. It is probably safe to say that most of the people who remember those days are dead too, so what's the difference?

It's in the presentation. An exhibit, a tour, or a sign, no matter how well- planned, will not appeal to anyone but the railroad fans if all it contains is information that only railroad fans can understand or relate to. Moms and babies will not care about nuts and bolts unless they understand why those technical things really matter. The interpretive profession - it really does exist! - has made great efforts to help museum people understand how to give nerdy information mass appeal.

Making it universal is key. A good interpreter only mentions the 22x28 cylinders if he has already given a his audience a reason to care. If not, it won't grab anyone's attention. If he wants the information to be interesting and to stick, he/she has to pick 1-3 main points that are easy to grasp and remember, and stick to them. They must relate the object at hand to something that most people will relate to in everyday life.

An example: "This locomotive was the bread-and-butter of the (a) men who ran/fired/maintained it, (b) company that owned it, and/or (c) the people and towns along the route, because it was a good paying job/got the job done/brought the milk and eggs to town. In this case, "bread-and-butter" is the universal concept that even mom can relate to: everyone's gotta make a living. Find out what's relevant to them, and make railroads relevant by drawing connections to those things. Livelihood, death, love, family, conflict, wealth, prosperity, etc., are universal concepts that can help people relate to your subject on their own terms because most people are familiar with them.

Once you've hooked people by making it personal, add relevant details or anecdotes that make it entertaining. Mention the cinders on the laundry for the benefit of one potential visitor (old Mrs so-and-so always knew to listen for that whistle!), and sure, throw in cylinder size for the railfan, but those details should relate to the main point in some way: "she hated having to run out and pull the laundry, but she had to eat canned vegetables during the flood when the railroad didn't run. " In this case, we're entertained by the mental image of her running out of the house when she hears the whistle, we are also reminded that she still depended on the railroad. Domestic examples just make it easier for, say, the mom to relate to an otherwise gritty subject. Similarly, if the cylinder size somehow relates to its operation on a heavily-graded branch, and a smaller engine just couldn't get the mail through, use that to make it relevant. Don't just let the facts and numbers hang out there for everyone to decipher. Bring it all back home to the main point. Give them something they can use.

Your interactive exhibits, active locomotives, buttons, lights, bells, and whistles will all help grab visitors' attention and make you competitive vs. movies and amusement parks, but until you can deliver good substance you will not stay competitive. Getting them in the door once is easy; getting them to stay and feel like they got their money's worth so that they'll t tell their friends and come back later takes some thought.

Why argue over whether or not it is authentic to say "all aboard" in a given situation, expecting a decisive answer, when what you really have is an opportunity to demonstrate what it means in the first place?

A museum exists to educate. If done right, it entertains and is competitive. If it doesn't do all three, it will not survive. When people pay to visit a museum, most still arrive expecting to learn something, --they just want it in a lighthearted and non-overbearing package.

Yes, there are a lotta dumb people out there, but assume that if they're willing to spend the admission, they want to be enriched in some way. If you treat them like they are idiots who only need to have something bright/loud/cute dangled in front of them to be happy, they will be underwhelmed at best, and offended at worst. Whether you charge admission or just get tax breaks for being 501(c)3, they are paying you for their experience. Show them some respect in return by demonstrating why you, the greybeards, and the railfans really care about this stuff. Why is it important? If you can tell them, do it. If you can show them, even better.

Whether it be books, seminars, or other training, locate the resources your museum needs to start learning how successful museums deliver a successful interpretive product. Then, keep in mind who you're really talking to next time you put together an exhibit, demonstration, or tour.

Look, I see it as pretty basic --- run the bloody things, do it as financially forthright as you can, and try an make it relevant to today's families. If you can't do the above, the fact that you 138 rivets on that side of the
tender instead of 139 ain't gonna amount to a hill of beans. Simple.

A few questions to ponder:

1.) We all moan about lack of duning, grants, etc., but how many of you
have TRULY looked outside of the box for funding? Or have you come
to rely SOLELY on grant writing and admissions as your source of
income?
2.) Is your organization or museum, in order to survive, willing to take
chances? Even if those chances mean laying it ALL on the line?
3.) Are the same names and exploits, ten, twenty or thirty years after
they happened, are what people remember about you?
4.) Have the same people run your organization or museum without any
changes? Have they released their grip on the organization or
museum long enough to think about their organization's life after their
has ended?
5.) Has your museum, board, or other inidividuals driven off/ away
anyone who has a thought or idea not their own, particularly young
people?
6.) Have you thoughtfully looked at your collection to see if you really
needed THAT piece? Is there a better home for it elsewhere, or better
yet, does ANOTHER entity have a piece that better fits your mission
with which you can trade?
7.) Are you willing to let a piece that DOES fit your mission go, knowing
you have neither the resources or the will to maintain/ restore it? Or
are you like most places, hording to the point that they have what
amounts to a glorified junk yard?
8.) How do you treat those who work for the railroads surrounding you?
Because the switchman, clerk or brakeman you treat like dirt today to
satisfy your ever-growing ego may be the trainsmaster or CFO who
tells you to stick it where the sun don't shine tomorrow.
9.) Do you FULLY comprehend that, what you do effects MORE than you?
or are you so ego-centric that you don't care how your actions affect
the greater preservation community?
10.) Have you changed exhibits, well, ever? Are the wheels of your rolling
stock rusted to the track they sit on? DO THEY SIT ON TRACK?

Having enough stuff doesn't do it. Owning your own property doesn't do it. Having an endowment won't do it. Having just secured the Holy Grail of
Surface Transport Funds-of-this-week won't do it. You have to be connected to the community and your public, bunky, or your gonna die. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but soon, and the scrapper is on speed dial these days....

Becuase when it comes right down to it, if another museum goes down, or another loco goes down, or this guy pisses off this railroad or person or whatever, it can all be for naught.

Call the guy who needs that part if you have it; pass the name of the trucker who is willing to haul equipment; go out and help that formerly hated rival engine or museum if their doing an event. To quote Franklin "We must all hang together or we shall all hang separately."

Save the CMO --- save the world. Or something to that effect....

TJG

This thread has been taking some very interesting twists and turns over the last few days. I notice the word "educate" keeps coming up frequently. Mind if I ask something at this point?

Where is the future generation of educators in this industry (and hobby) coming from?

I ask this because when I go to the local chapter meetings of the big name national historical organizations, I don't see a lot of "education" going on, usually just a pretty picture slide showing competition. And when they get offered a good historic or technical program, they will frequently turn it down. Not too long ago I had one program chairperson tell me "what we want here is great photography, nobody here cares how things work". Curious as attending their meetings I would rate the photography in that group as considerably less than great and the presentations as kind of poor. Guess that's part of the reason its the same declining group of regulars showing up month after month after month.

Seems like kind of a sparse support environment out there for developing serious presentations with educational value, or is there help on the way?

MX

MX,
I guess the group you are speaking of really doesn't care about the future. So be it. Groups like that might just as well die out. Perhasp they're Just a bunch of ole geezers that want to see RR pics. They are spectators not participants. Why don't they just stay home and surf the web?

That being said, I can tell from many I meet and reading much of the dialog here that there ARE many groups interested in the future. Like it or not much of that future lies in education.

Stuffed & mounted relics might just as well be a trophy on a shelf if nobdy tells the story behind them.

We have talked to educators (school field trips) and guests coming to our museum and they all have good ideas. Some grades/age groups want to learn the science behind things...How does a steam engine work, what effect does friction have on the rails, how efficient is a train, etc etc.

Some want the history or social impact of railroads presented. Some want the economic impact presented. All depends on the age group.

Some just want to be entertained.

What I get from them is that we have the potential to teach and entertain on a lot of subjects. We just need to learn how. Forums like this help spread the knowledge.

Ever been to EPCOT? Disney wrote the book on how to teach and entertain at the same time. (Just wish we had WDW money!)

Bill

My dream is a little different. Rather than "stuffed and mounted" I would like to offer a fabulous research archive that bona fide historians could use as a reseearch center. In our region, all such facilities are housed in leased space. This may not be a revenue stream, unless we can keep that going, everything else we have will lose the context in which it was designed.

While I agree that a research archive would be a very nice thing to have for future generations of authors, I think that to be self sustaining it would have to be run on a pay-for-time or pay-per-document basis. I think it would also have to be electronic or at least have an internet index in order to be useful to a wider geographic distribution of researchers. Otherwise you end up with the situation of the (now stored) NRHS library, downtown in a big city, expensive and inconvenient to access except for those who make use of the public transportation network. Going electronic helps to solve some of the storage space problem, it also helps avoid the problem of having to close down completely if the paper archive has to be relocated.

One looming problem with the preservation of archives is eBay. I have watched in the last two years as several incredible collections of people who were industry leaders were auctioned on eBay through antique dealers by relatives who wanted to turn the paper into money. With an economic downturn underway, this is going to be more and more common.

MX

Lost and dispersed collections is exactly my point. Digitizing is obviously the key, but cataloguing is even more critical so that future researchers will even know that an item actually exists. We will not likely scan of microfishe everything, but if it is on a searchable list with appropriate keywrods tagged to it, research will be much easier. Put the catalog on line and let future historians research at home and plan their visits strategically. I know this won't save our museum, but it will fulfill our mission. Shoot, we may lose the people who know how to operate and repair our running collection in the next 20 years. Then we would be forced to static display or worse, but the archive could be the last thing left standing... for a long. long time.

This was a discussion at a local meeting recently. We were talking about the value of a separate configurable database program as an index. It would be very nice to be able to search for about a dozen key words tagged to each document. Of course since computers now allow much longer descriptive names for documents, it is possible to come up with a pretty good self-indexing name system that does part of the job for you without a database. If the system is applied consistently you can generate a list that will fall right into sequence when viewed with windows explorer and will convey much of the information a separate index would provide.

MX (Obviously Not My Real Name)

TJ, You've hit the nail squarely and strongly on the head. You could almost call your comments "how to wreck a museum in 10 easy steps". Unfortunately, far too many people use them as a business plan, then piss & moan about how the (insert "community", "railfans" "railroad" "politicians" or other aplicable excuse word or combination thereof) is against them.

Shouldn't this forum be the place where we establish a protocol for railrelated indexing? A standard throughout the rail preservation industry now rather than later would be really helpful.