If you look
> carefully at a picture of a Lake Shore
> Electric steel car you can see the side
> plating bulging around the side sill while
> the cars were in service (1915-1938). The
> window frames were mahogany and sat directly
> on the steel. I believe Jewett later solved
> the problem with gasketed brass windows on
> later cars.

Which Lake Shore car was this? I worked on one for a while that had been a house in Vermillion for quite some time. It is now in a Jewett-based exhibit in Newark, Ohio (Final home of Jewett Car Company). I believe that car was the 174 or 171...

TJG

Port Huron Museum

peremarquette@hotmail.com

Hore hair isn't a problem, asbestos is. Was this material used by Pullman in walls and other areas in light weight car construction? Were there certain years of manufacture that one should be vigilant with?

God Bless,
Gerald Kopiasz
> The advice above about burnable insulation
> is well given. The only sure solution that I
> know of is to dismantle the interior of the
> car and remove anything burnable before
> cutting or grinding on the carside. All that
> horsehair probably needs to be cleaned out,
> anyway. But hosing everything with water
> beforehand may serve.

> One other bit of advice needs to be
> amplified. Because the carside of a
> lightweight is structural, the side sill
> cannot be cut out without providing
> alternative support (in the area between the
> body bolsters where it acts as the tension
> member of the side truss). Neither can much
> of the side plating be removed at one time -
> it provides the triangular bracing for the
> square framing. Volume 1 of the T.R.A.In.
> passenger-car publication contains the
> instructions developed by SP for re-siding
> Pullman-Standard lightweights, including
> jacking up the carbody so it doesn't sag
> during surgery and the fixtures for holding
> the new car side as it is applied.

> Aarne H. Frobom
> The Steam Railroading Institute
> P. O. Box 665
> Owosso, MI 48867


hrrhs@aol.com

> Hore hair isn't a problem,

Gerald, you misspelled something here in one of two ways. I leave it to you to consider which.

I am finding asbestos like materials on piping and within the wall and roof cavities of the older Pullman product in the shop now. We are encapsulating in place. Also have put out several fires in the equine hair (well, we did find a pair of jockey shorts) and what seems to have been wood in the distant past. Be careful.

Dave

irondave@bellsouth.net

The one we are working on is 167 (last to operate).
The sides were straight but the window post channels did need bracing. I have seen the sides bow out on several of the cars due to excessive corrosion. The first three (167,168,169) had to have been experimental since they came with (unneeded) truss rods. The windows sat right against the steel and the glass molding was not wide enough to shed water. In the later cars the windows sat against wood molding which also held the water.

Interesting to read that you were in on that restoration, any pix available? It certainly has been kept quiet. I have been meaning to get down to see it, but the time keeps slipping by.


lamontdc@adelphia.net

Oops, I mean't the animal with hooves as opposed to the other animal...

I'm definately careful when it comes to the potential of asbestos. Fortunately, I do know people that are experienced with it. Also, I'll try to steer clear of any shorts. Were those vintage? ;)

God Bless,
Gerald Kopiasz

> Gerald, you misspelled something here in one
> of two ways. I leave it to you to consider
> which.

> I am finding asbestos like materials on
> piping and within the wall and roof cavities
> of the older Pullman product in the shop
> now. We are encapsulating in place. Also
> have put out several fires in the equine
> hair (well, we did find a pair of jockey
> shorts) and what seems to have been wood in
> the distant past. Be careful.

> Dave


hrrhs@aol.com

I should let you know it was in the fairly early stages, between about 1996-1997. They finished the car this Spring however, and they did basically a nice job. A rather large whole had been cut in her side, and it was a trip to get the right, but that was one of the major accomplishments when I was there. Also, I found it humorous that the header of the door that i painstackingly removed paint from (I found a Jewett Decal underneath, so had to pretty careful, and would recommend the same to you if your restoring) is now on display inside the museum rather than in the car. The director that i worked under left becuase the people there, well, were uncomfortable with his PhD. Fun town, that Newark. I figured it would take 5 years to get it looking like something with the budget they had ('nil beyond car purchase and removal price) and looks like I was right. I'd be happy to help you guys out where I can though.

TJ

> The one we are working on is 167 (last to
> operate).
> The sides were straight but the window post
> channels did need bracing. I have seen the
> sides bow out on several of the cars due to
> excessive corrosion. The first three
> (167,168,169) had to have been experimental
> since they came with (unneeded) truss rods.
> The windows sat right against the steel and
> the glass molding was not wide enough to
> shed water. In the later cars the windows
> sat against wood molding which also held the
> water.

> Interesting to read that you were in on that
> restoration, any pix available? It certainly
> has been kept quiet. I have been meaning to
> get down to see it, but the time keeps
> slipping by.


tjgaffney@phmuseum.org

Sounds like it was a lot of fun! We had an interesting time because everything that could be removed was (1938 and scrap prices were high). A set of body bolsters wasn't too bad, restoration of the truss rods, hangers and straps was time consuming .. and the threading of same was a picnic. Compressor hangers were mainly from pictures as were the resistor hangers. Radial coupler hangers and gear came as close as possible.
Brake system will be M22 like the original. A rubber roof is sort of saving the original underneath. Right now the project is in Limbo with no dollars, no storage and no workers so we have to see what the future holds. Thanks


lamontdc@adelphia.net