On Nov. 4, 2008, most of the culprits who approve the decision makers at the RMPA are up for re-election. Are you registered to vote?

Scott,

I work for the National Park Service and they too have a lot of rules; they have Friends groups to work the kind of trades that you are suggesting.

I would get in contact with the Friends of the RR Museum of Pennsylvania and see what they can come up with. They have been around for years.

The museum does on occasion buy items as big as rail cars and accepts donations of rail cars.

Yes, they should have something from the East Broad Top narrow gauge railroad. There was a lot of narrow gauge in the state at one time.

Ted Miles

FRIENDS OF THE RAILROAD MUSEUM OF PENNSYLVANIA BOARD OF DIRECTORS
Mr. Robert J. Lawrence, President Mr. Craig Haberle, Vice President
Mr. Joseph Savoca, Secretary Mr. David Wood, Treasurer
Mr. Robert Donecker Mr. Joel Long
Mr. Grant Markley Mr. Joseph Palenchar
Mrs. Margaret S. Poore Mr. James R. Rose
Mr. Thomas E. Schoelkopf Mr. John Schwartzenberg Jr
Mr. David W. Dunn, ex officio

The Friends of the Railroad Museum of Pennsylvania is a non-profit volunteer organization chartered by the PHMC. It is a 501(c)3 corporation registered as a charitable organization (Registration # 3439). The official registration and financial information of the Friends may be obtained from the Pennsylvania Department of State by calling toll free, within Pennsylvania, 800 732-0999.
Museum Phone 717 687-8628 FAX 717 687-0876 E-mail info@rrmuseumpa.org

James Alexander Jr.,
Project Director and Webmaster

James Alexander Jr.,
82 Sycamore Ct.
Lawrenceville, NJ 08648

Good Luck,
Len.

Oh, come on. Unless there's some rich millionaire going up to the auction willing and ready to buy the loco and surprise Altoona, Huntington, Strasburg, or wherever with it, it's NOT going to happen.

Such acquisitions do NOT happen in a vacuum. For this to happen, it would have been necessary for the RR Museum of Pa and/or the Friends, long in advance, to 1) identify the particular locomotive as a target for future acquisition and 2) negotiate the terms of acquisition--even going as far as identifying potential donors or loan-makers willing to front the money, in the case of a surprise death, estate sale, auction, or whatnot.

I've been hearing mutterings about how 38 "belonged" in the RR Museum of Pa. since I rode a mixed train 100 miles behind it one day in 1984 or so. I have no idea if the Museum agrees with our assessment of its appropriateness.

There are folks out there--and we know who some of them are--that can make something like this happen with short notice. No offense, but the directors of the Museum aren't those folks, as far as I can tell.

Unfortunately, With what I have seen on this forum and others I think we are going to see 5 steam locomotives become scrap before the end of the year. It sucks but we can't save them all. We have to save what we can within reason.

Steve B.

Five? Would you care to elaborate? I'm guessing you mean the two at K&K, but what are the other three?

I would suspect that the H&BT 38 is quite salvageable, and may well wind up under steam at a new home. And the SY is probably not hopeless, either. The fire damage seems to be from the running boards up, and mostly to thinner sheet metal parts. It's all a matter of how hungry the scrapmen are, vs any railroad looking for a steam locomotive. Steel scrap is way down right now, and that may be the saving grace.

There is at least one Northeastern line actively looking for a additional steam locomotive, and they have the expertise to make 38 a runner again.

There are some very interesting items that either perished in the fire (that wood coach, for example) or are endangered in the auction (like the two C&I twin-hoppers).

Howard P.
who will NOT be in PA this weekend....

Howard, just looking at what has happened over this last year with steam locomotives being shut down. Yes we have some bright spots which is great news but we all know plenty of steamers just sitting idle on a museum dead line waiting for work. Volunteers seem to be hard to come by and I've said this before young folks are not interested is working on a big olde' steam locomotive.
The other three are the scrap yard queens in Roanoke, yes there is an effort to save them but they need, let me say it, money to move them. I wish them luck!!!! Lots of it! I hope they do get them moved it would be, IMO, a huge bright spot in the preservation world.
Maybe somebody will come forward and buy the 2 K&Ks but its the moving cost they have to worry about. They do have a year to get them moved off the property according to the auction site. I hate to be negative just looking at this from the cost of getting them.
One more point, were I'm from we have 8 steam locomotives within 2 hours of here that are just sitting waiting.
3 at New Hope
2 at Whippany
1 at Jim Thorpe
2 at Strasburg
I didn't include Steamtown.

Steve B.

I am with Howard on this one. #38 has been coveted by many (with resources to acquire her) for a long time. Unless a scrapper wants to pay more than $100K for her (tounge in cheek) she will not be scrapped. I seriously doubt the SY would be recycled either. Even getting her at 10% above scrap for the frame and running gear would give a platform for a "rebuild." Our British counterparts have done more with less. To them, a frame and running gear is half the battle.

Now as to the five steamers that will be scrapped by years end... I wouldn't count on that.

Even if the three in Roanoke go, they are not the greatest losses. And the fourth is already out.

The list of engines waiting is a rather spurious argument at this point as only one of these (the USA 0-6-0 at New Hope) has been on the market.

Of these 9 you list, none have the regional appeal or recent operating track record of #38. Simply put, #38 is much more sought after and she is for sale. And, there are "plans" for at least 2 of these 9.

#1098 is coveted by a few, too, but the Hart estate settlement has not occurred yet.

Your "9 waiting" list also ignores the fact that there are 19 operating in this same geographic region (two hours of Harrisburg) and at least 4 more approaching service in the next 6 months.

Is having 9 "in reserve" a bad thing when 19 are operating?

Rob

Rob

Hold on Rob, I didn't say would be, I said I think they we are going, it's IMO. I'm not sure how many are operational right now in my area but we do have several.
I don't know if I would call them in reserve, IMO that would mean I can go to them un-cover them fill them up with water and fuel and get them rolling.

Don't get me wrong I want to see them saved but I feel with the way the economy is its going to be tough to get the money to move them. Why do I say the cost of moving them? That's your biggest expense. Steamtown has flat cars loaded with donated/bougth that the owners now can't move due to the cost of the move.

Side note, I think the chinese steamer could fit in to Steamtown. Why? It represents steam locomotive technology development through the 20th century. Food for thought.

Steve,

I hear you, I did not mean to sound as argumentative as I did.

;-)

The SY at Steamtown makes me chuckle, it is the ultimate stretch of the "run Canadian engines so you don't wear out US engines" argument! Why not?

And of course, part of me is bitter my lottery tickets were not the winners, as I WANT those two C&I hoppers saved. Recently around the net there has been discussion of GP-7's and other locos being put up for scrap, but freight cars from the steam era are even more rare, and quite frankly the two bay hopper is probably the least preserved when you figure the ratio of how many there were to how many are saved. Riveted tanks cars may also make that claim.

With hoppers, I am not so worried about roadnames as styles preserved.

The C&I cars would be a fit in several PA museums, including the budding industrial history museum in Bethlehem. If I could purchase and donate, I would.

I would imagine that I am not the only one who saw a 25% drop in investments on my Q3 statements, so I would expect that the chances of a angel flying in and saving those hoppers is pretty slim.

Rob

No problem Rob. ;) I wish my lottery tickets would pay! :) There is a specific 2-8-0 that would be bought and sent home as a donation! The problem we all have is, we have great ideas but, we all can't seem to get together and buy stuff. Look at this forum, there are 1800 members, if we all donated $10 to purchasing say those hoppers I bet we could get them.

I'm in! Where do I send my $10?

Steve B.
"One more point, were I'm from we have 8 steam locomotives within 2 hours of here that are just sitting waiting.
3 at New Hope
2 at Whippany
1 at Jim Thorpe
2 at Strasburg
I didn't include Steamtown."

You forgot Reading & Northern 425 , and Wanamaker Kempton & Southern .
From Jersey just go out Rt.78. west.

Len.

Since J David Conrad was kind enough to announce that the Valley RR will be accepting the Chinese SY, is anyone going to announce their proud acquisition on H & BTM no. 38?

[quote="Schuylkill Valley"]Mr. Mitchell,
If you want this steamer saved, why don't you buy it and then have it restored, After all you must have a good enough of a bank account, being a well to do person like your self.

There you go Len!
Point well taken!!
That'll do it!!!