Forking a topic out of the carbon caps thread. Biodiesel.

As a transportation tech junkie, I happen to think biodiesel is just the bee's knees. I want everyone in preservation to use it on historic engines. NOT because I love the environment, but because I think it's actually better for diesel engines than fossil diesel. Especially since they took the sulfur out of it.

Who has worked with it? What has your experience been?

Who hasn't tried it, and why not?

As a mechanical engineer, former automotive diesel mechanic, and a member of a biodiesel co-op, I have some experience with this fuel.

On the plus side:
- It can be derived from many sources
- It burns well and has a higher cetane rating than petro-based diesel
- It has better lubricity than low sulfur diesel
- It is biodegradable

Plus & Minus:
- A good solvent (can clean your fuel system out...leading to frequent filter changes initially)

On the minus side:
- Slightly less BTUs than petro-based diesel (though I have seen either similar or slightly better fuel economy using this fuel in my personal cars - possibly due to the higher cetane rating)
- More prone to biological growths (can be countered with additives, etc.)
- Higher cloud point (requiring fuel heating in colder climates)
- Some variability in fuel quality depending on feedstock

Overall, my experiences with this fuel have been positive. For the long term, if the fuel can be sourced from used cooking oils, agricultural waste products or algae based stock i.e. not directly made from food stocks (grains, corn, etc.) at a competitive rate then it will be a viable option for the future...and that includes diesel locomotives and even steam locomotives.

These are the problems I've encountered. I have a feeling some of our problems stem from the original quality of the fuel. The problems were:
1. Bio Growth came quick and heavy and our traditional treatment didn't seam to have an effect.
2. The Fuel also seamed to be much more temperature sensitive then the current fuel we use. It seamed to cloud in the 40 to 50 degree range.
3. Shelve life, the fuel we used did not store well. It was left in the fuel tank of an air compressor over a 6 month period (Late fall to middle spring in Ohio). When we went to drain the fuel tank to put fresh fuel in, we were amazed at the nasty ugly mess that we found. We ended up hot tanking the tank to get it clean.
I was told by an engineer specializing in fuel and oils that stabilizers are not added as of yet to Bio-diesel and that is where our problem came from.
Thinking back this was over 2 years ago now and hopefully improvements have been made.
I'm not against using it in the future again but we are going to wait and see what type of assurances are in place to assure a consistent quality of fuel.
Jack

There are two other techniques that can be used to help counter biological growth:
1) Get the water out as much as possible - I have seen absorbent crystals used effectively for this
2) Kill anything that might be present in the fuel - an ultraviolet light is an option there

How about biodiesel as a cleaning solvent? The "nontoxic, biodegradeable" really catches my attention, along with "low-VOC if you're in territory that cares about that.

This would really interest me as a fuel for steam locomotives.

I'd be interested to see if anyone has attempted the use of bio fuel in an oil-burner.

Would be kinda cool to have the local excursion go by at about 11am and to leave a trail of smoke in the air that smelled like french fries... just kidding. Seriously though, I wonder what sorts of issues there would be for the use of some bio-based liquid fuel for a steam locomotive.

Folks,

The SF Maritime Park uses Bio-Diesel in the engines of the Schooner ALMA and in our (originally gas) tug boat Telco.

These are both Detroit 71 series Diesels.

I am told that they will have to be replaced soon because they will no longer meet California air polution standards even with the Bio fuel.

There used to be a lot of 71 ands 108 series Detroit Diesels in harbor carft of various kinds

Ted Miles

Biodiesel has been used in steam locomotives.

Disneyland in California...and I believe Disneyworld as well...are now running their fleet on biodiesel. I don't remember if it is straight (B100) or a blend with petro-diesel. I seem to recall that they did some modifications to their fuel system (probably different fuel lines).

We ran a 5% mixture of biodiesel in with our regular fuel on a short run of the 3751 to San Pedro in 2007 with no adverse affects.

I would be somewhat loathe to convert to the fuel straight off without a transition period to allow for the bio to clean out any accumulated gunk in the fuel tank...

About this time last year, we experimented with biofuel mixtures on the Pacific Coast Railroad, gradually working up to about a 60/40 biodiesel/No. 2 ratio in two locomotives and with no modification to the firing setup. I cannot speak as an expert, but can attest to my experiences and observations both as a fireman and as the apprentice mechanic who had to clean up after it. At lower concentrations, there was no noticeable difference than with our usual straight No. 2 (in fact, with our 19-ton Vulcan, I almost preferred it), but once we crossed the threshold of having more bio than No. 2 things started to get ugly. The reduction in BTUs was very apparent, not only by the increased fuel consumption but also struggle to keep steam on an engine that already took a fight to make it. And the final straw was during our Christmas trains last year, when we couldn't make it three hours into the day on a freshly-punched set of tubes without having to shut down and send the poor skinny kid into the smokebox for some emergency angioplasty before the pile would boil water again (and boy, were they clogged!) -- plus blow back a few times after the bio's solvent properties kicked in and set stuff loose in the line. The end of that operation also necessitated a very thorough cleaning for the firebox, including the clearing of "bio goo" blockage from the slits of the burner via a file and flathead screwdriver. That was the last time the PCRR ever experimented with biodiesel.

Though our trials may have been less than successful, Disneyland and Walt Disney World seem very satisfied burning their B98 (98% soybean oil, 2% red diesel), and given the circumstances I don't discount the potential for biofuels becoming a practical, more environmentally-friendly alternative to burning diesel or heavier oils. For anyone seriously considering the switch, I suggest talking to Phil Reader, the PCRR's CMO, who has also had many a conversation with people over at "the Mouse."

One thing we have noticed in our automobiles running biodiesel is that there is definitely variability in fuel performance depending on the feedstock for the bio. Our biodiesel co-op shops around for the best fuel prices and has occasionaly come across loads of bad fuel. If I recall correctly, these were typically mixtures with high percentages of animal fat based feedstock...

The Vulcan at Pacific Coast burned the bio fuel the best. The Porter on the other hand with its limited heating surface had issues with sooting up. Also we had algae build up in the fuel tank of that locomotive.

I make my own B-87 using WVO and making sure that it is not derrived from any type of animal fat. I currently use it in my Powerstroke Ford, two John Deere's, a Massey Ferguson, 3208 Cat, and a Mercedes 300. Also I have been running it in live steam locomotives from 7.5" gauge to 15" gauge. All have had no effects in the past year.
Filtering and de-watering is key to making it work.

By cutting the WVO with #2 the BTU's are very acceptable. I last ran a 50/50 cut in a 5" scale 15" gauge Consolidation and it burned very well and with little soot.

Using the Disney B-98 with virgin soybean oil is very expensive, yet it keeps all contaminates out and does not need the processing with lye and methyl alcohol.

Next up for the Pacific Coast is an experiment with Natural Gas.

Jeff "Grumps" Badger
Engineer/Mechanic
Pacific Coast Railroad

Interesting, so you're using straight vegetable oil (SVO), which is a somewhat different thing than biodiesel. It's definitely a win if SVO works, because it saves the step and expense of the chemical process to transesterify it into biodiesel. I also like hearing about WVO (waste vegetable oil, aka used fryer oil) being used, because that stuff is practically free, lol!

My son used straight vegetable oil in a truck. He had two tanks, one with vegetable oil and one with biodiesel. Started with the biodiesel. Once the system was warm - there was a heater for the vegetable oil - switched to vegetable oil. Before he would stop he would switch back to biodiesel to have the less viscous diesel in the fuel lines when he wanted to start up again. My arborist has the same system in his truck and he is satisfied with it.

Mt. Washington's #9 Waumbek (the engine Nigel Day modernized) also burned biodiesel, up to 100%. Word is that the oil firing system was subsequently removed although not due to any fault with the oil firing system.

I'd think that true biodiesel is "over-refined" for what you'd need to burn in a steam locomotive. I.E.- it would work great, but you probably could burn straight waste cooking oil (or similar products) with just some filtration. This might be a much cheaper source of fuel compared to true biodiesel.

Hugh, I agree with using the straight WVO after filtering and dewatering in a steam locomotive application as an alternative to the needed additives used and by-products made from conversion to bio. Just like Bunker C and other heating oils, the WVO or SVO would have to be heated to flow properly.

I use a barrel heater in my processing as it allows the water to separate much quicker and allows the mixing of the other petroleum products to bind together. What I have as a finished product is called B-87 which has a slightly higher viscosity than #2 and runs well in internal combustion and in the steam locomotives I have fired on. In my process I do not use the lye & methanol method. The by-product of glycerin that is infused with methanol cannot be disposed of properly. In the county I live in now, the local agencies are enforcing HMMP's and quantifying permits through the local fire departments and envrionmental agency to allow the storage of methanol and to have a batch plant using that process.

Jeff Badger