The FA is owned by the Anthracite Railroads Historical Society. Their original plan was to paint it as a Lehigh Valley FA (which it isn't - I think it's an SP&S unit). Back about 15-20 years ago the ARHS was big on buying a lot of anthracite roads equipment but it appears their volunteer effort has petered out. They recently sold (or did some other kind of deal) their CNJ RS-3 to the Delaware Lackawanna Railroad. The F3 painted for the CNJ (ex-BAR) is going to the Morristown & Erie with one owned by Tri-State Chapter NRHS where I understand both are going to be painted in Lackawanna colors. They have an ex-B&M F7B unit that may join them. It would appear they are open to offers so if someone wants to restore an FA here may be your opportunity.

From my archives, compiled over a period of about 9 years, locations on some units need updated. Forgive the formatting; I don't have the time to re-enter everything.
At least two of the FA units in Bridgeton, NJ are operational, as is Doyle McCormack's PA NKP 190. As far as I know, the FPA4s are either all operational or they don't need much to be so.

There is an A-B-A set of both FA1s and FA2s in New Jersey. The reason why the FAs are in disrepair is that the great majority of them are owned/controlled by non-profits with no $$$, will, technical expertise, or a combination of any of these, to get them operational. The only exception to this is the Bridgeton, New Jersey FAs that are light years ahead of the rest of them. I guess those of us who care should be glad that there will be representatives of both models preserved and returned to operational status.


MODEL ORIG B/N DATE DISPOSITION LOCATION LIRR NOTES

FA1 SP&S 856 76671 02/49 PRIVATELY OWNED BRIDGETON, NJ 611
FA1 SP&S 866 78286 12/50 PRIVATELY OWNED BROOKLYN, OR 613
FA1 SP&S 858 76673 04/49 PRIVATELY OWNED BRIDGETON, NJ 614
FA1 SP&S 864 76838 04/49 SEPTA 615 MOW
FA1 SP&S 860 76675 02/49 QUEBEC CENTRAL TOURIST TRAIN 616
FA1 NH 428 75425 ??/47 RAILWAY MUSEUM DANBURY, CT 617
FA1 NH 401 75276 ??/47 RR MUSEUM OF NE 618
FA1 CN 9400 CANADIAN RWY MUS
FB1 SP&S 868B PRIVATELY OWNED BRIDGETON, NJ

FA2 NYC 1102 79301 10/51 WNY RHS NYNH&H 0401 600
FA2 L&N 317 81964 06/56 PRIVATELY OWNED BRIDGETON, NJ 601
FA2 L&N 309 80903 05/56 PRIVATELY OWNED BRIDGETON, NJ 602
FA2 L&N 315 81087 06/56 ANTHRACITE SOC 603 as LV 596
FA2 L&N 314 81086 06/56 RAILWAY MUSEUM UNION, IL 604
FA2 L&N 310 80904 05/56 PRIVATELY OWNED NASHVILLE, TN 605
FA2 WM 303 78606 01/51 PRIVATELY OWNED BELINGTON, WV 607
FA2 WM 304 78607 01/51 LIRR 3100 608
FA2 WM 302 78495 01/51 WM RWY HS BELINGTON,WV 610
FA2 CP 4090 CANADA MUS OF RT CRANBROOK, BC
FB2 CP 4469 CANADA MUS OF RT CRANBROOK, BC
FB2 BCR PRIVATELY OWNED BRIDGETON, NJ

PA1 ATSF 59L 76535 ??/48 PRIVATELY OWNED BROOKLYN, OR
PA1 ATSF 62L 76541 ??/48 PRIVATELY OWNED BROOKLYN, OR

FPA4 CN 67?? Napa Valley RR 70
FPA4 CN 67?? Napa Valley RR 71
FPA4 CN 67?? Napa Valley RR 72
FPA4 CN 67?? Napa Valley RR 73

FPA4 CN 6773 Grand Canyon Rwy
FPA4 CN 6762 Grand Canyon Rwy
FPA4 CN 6768 Grand Canyon Rwy
FPA4 CN 6793 Grand Canyon Rwy
FPB4 CN 6871 Grand Canyon Rwy
FPB4 CN 6860 Grand Canyon Rwy

FPA4 CN 6777 Cuyahoga Valley Scenic as CVSRR 14
FPA4 CN 6771 Cuyahoga Valley Scenic as CVSRR 15
FPA4 CN 6767 Cuyahoga Valley Scenic
FPA4 CN 6780 Cuyahoga Valley Scenic as B&O 800

FPA4 CN 6789 Monticello Rwy Museum
FPB4 CN 6862 Monticello Rwy Museum

FPA4 CN 6764 New York & Lake Erie
FPA2 CN 6758 New York & Lake Erie

FPA4 CN 6786 Danbury Rwy Museum as NYC 1390
FPB4 CN 6867 Danbury Rwy Museum as NYC 3399
FPA4 CN 6763 Steamtown Railroad Museum
FPA4 CN 6765 CANADIAN RAILWAY MUSEUM
FPB4 CN 686 WAINWRIGHT RAILWAY MUSEUM 1

FPB4 CN 6854 BRIDGETON, NJ ex-BCR RCC2

It's Doyle McCormack that owns the ex-Santa Fe PA #62L, (Ex-D&H #18) now being restored at Brooklyn, OR as "NKP 190". Granted his website hasn't been updated since 2008, but there's been no word about it being operational yet. #59L (ex-D&H #16) was still just a shell languishing at Albany, OR. at last report, waiting for its owner, the Smithsonian Institution, to take some action toward restoring it.

I can think of several possible explanations.

The first is that the PA is the 747 of diesel locomotives. With that huge long nose, it's instantly recognizable, and memorable. As somebody else mentioned, it just looks fast and streamlined. The FA looks nice too, but it's not quite as distinctive as the PA.

The second is that the PA had a good a press agent. :) They became famous when D&H ran them long after most covered wagons were out of service. The resulting photos and articles made them well known amongst railfans.

The third reason is that there are still some FA's in existence. I won't join the debate on how many are operational, but I was of the impression that some are at least survivors. The PA's are essentially extinct, so saving those two became a priority.

The last reason is that Doyle McCormack loves PA's. He recalls them from when he was a child living in Conneaut, OH on the Nickel Plate. So he wanted to restore one to opration. Unlike most railfans who would like to see an engine from their youth run again, Doyle has the ability and connections to make it happen. His efforts have been well chronicled, and folks are cheering him on, as they should.

The book called "Outliers" talks about how things don't happen in a vacuum, and how there are always a lot of hidden reasons why one thing gets favored over another or one person does better than another. Sometimes luck and chance factor into things like this far more than folks like to admit.

(A great example... Why are there no NYC Hudsons left? Again, luck, but in this case bad luck... It wasn't that they weren't deserving.)

I'm pretty sure it's not yet operational. If it was, I wonder if he'd be taking it along on the trip back east? Much of the carbody has been repainted, and looks great.

Might it be suggested that at least part of the original interest and appeal of the PA, in particular in Santa Fe garb, may be traced back to Lionel ? Many a railfan has gotten his/her start having their respective interests peaked by a colorful model train.

There is an open question due to the circumstances surrounding the damage whether it was actually thieves intent on the value of the copper or, far more likely, a party who did not want the units to be restored by their owner. I believe the circumstances were discussed here shortly after it happened.

Their owner has made quite a bit of progress on the restoration, especially given that his crew is working without a shop and only occasional access to heavy equipment.

GME

American Flyer produced the PA as their streamlined diesel, Lionel primarily had the EMD F unit.
And for the toy trains, Flyer's S scale tended to be more true to 'scale' overall than Lionel's O gauge.

I have a theory, that the driving force behind many collections is to make a complete "train set" like they had as a kid. Thus the hunt for a particular kind of car or locomotive - or maintaining and restoring one favored piece of equipment over another.

Of course American Flyer, not Lionel,,, I stand corrected !

Lionel did, however make an FA-1 in Santa Fe Warbonnet red/silver. I had to "settle" for one of those when my family wouldn't spring for a matched set of Lionel Santa Fe A-A F3's. (I was grateful for the FA-1 anyway.) I'm sure that has something to do with me liking Santa Fe Alcos in Warbonnet colors.

Speaking of the 251, the 4 D&H PA's were converted to "PA4's" by Morrison-Knudsen in the early-'70s with 251 engines. I'd be interested in knowing if that conversion significantly increased their reliability. I'm guessing it did because D&H used them for several years after that, leased them to MBTA until 1978, and then they had enough value to be sold into Mexico where at least one operated regularly until the mid-'80s. (#17 and #19 were rebuilt again in 1989-1991 but I'd consider that a separate life.)


(So if a PA is like a 747, is an FA like a 747SP?)

As a native Southern Californian, and one-time Santa Fe employee, I think that one of the reasons for the popularity of the PA was that it looked splendid (dare I say "gorgeous"?) in the Santa Fe "Warbonnet" paint job, and ATSF had no FA's. At nearly the same aesthetic level as the Warbonnet, was the SP "Daylight" color scheme, and I don't think SP had FA's either.

> So if a PA is like a 747, is an FA like a 747SP?

I would characterize the FA locmotives more as 737s; not as glamorous and elegant as the PA, but it did everything the PA could do and was more of a workhorse.

ANYTHING in Santa Fe warbonnet gets a lot of attention. Why do you think the D&H adopted that scheme for the PA4s? Loyalty to ATSF? Hardly. Just a beautiful paint scheme that was universally admired.

You forgot the 6776. The 6762 and 6768 are both parts units for GCRY. The 6773, 6776, and 6871 are painted green with gold lettering, while the 6793 and 6860 are silver with black lettering.

As to the NKP 190 running yet, no it does not. Most of their time lately has been focused on the 4449 and its crew car for their upcoming trip.

appreciate the interesting discussion and varying opinions on the "PA" / "FA" discussion. Doesn't the short line / tourist railroad in Ohio (Cayouga.. I am sure that is spelled wrong ) ... have a few of the Canadian versions...

so its safe to say ( I believe ) that every operational alco styled cab unit operating in this country is a Canadian locomotive ? ( napa wine train, grand canyon rr )... Is there an operational unit down on the Western Maryland Scenic area .. ( was it once painted B&O, then perhaps WM ? ) ... I have not heard or seen anything about this unit in some time...

thanks

Dean Levin

There are two additional PA-s "preserved" in Brazil They are from a 3 unit order for the Paulista Railway Serial numbers 80440-80442 built in October 1953 I believe they are a PA-3 model