Does anyone have a sure-fire method for authenticating an original builder's plate from a fake one? What sort of imperfections should one look for? Any information provided is appreciated. Thanks!

K.R. Bell
RR Museum of PA

http://rrmuseumpa.org

Im sure others can chime in here but absolute number one dead giveaway is a perfectly flat Baldwin plate that allegedly came off the smokebox of a locomotive- if they arent curved, bent or damaged from someone trying to flatten them (some have tried and it usually damages the plate) or even bending damage from someone attempting to pry it off a locomotive, it probably is a fake. Theres probably a few exceptions where Baldwin plates werent curved but dont delude yourself into believing you have one of those.

staybolt@bellsouth.net

One example of a place where a flat plate would be authentic would be if it came off a tank or street ry "dummy" engine, something where it would have been placed on a flat surface. You should always get info on the loco based on the builder's number on the plate and see what it looked like. Most plates were used on a surface that would have been curved, but the others also exited.

Museum of Transportation
rdgoldfede@aol.com

Mr Bell,

You pose an interesting question. We have the same problem in the maritime preservation business with ship and engine builders plates.

Photos are usually the answer does it look like the other plates issued by the same builder?
Are the materiels correct? Did the company usually make them in brass and your plate is steel? Watch out!

It may be different with railroads but in the ship side aluminum was never used.

By the way, I just renewed my membership. Thanks for your good work. TM

ted_miles@NPS.gov

What sort of imperfections
> should one look for?

Imperfections are the key. Look for crooked or poorly spaced construction numbers and dates. If you or I were to reproduce a builder's plate, we would make it as perfect as possible. But, because of the large number of plates that the builders had cast, the plates' numbers were added to the pattern as needed.

ironbartom@aol.com

But I think the issue is when an authentic builder's plate has been used to create molds for fraudulent plates. In my experience, Porter plates were flat. I1sa plates were both cast iron andbronze with the "a" brazed onto the original plate. ALCO plates varied in size from the larger iron plates to some that were no bigger than a 3"x5" note card. I've seen flat LIMA plates that were bolted to the sides of a round smokebox.
On the silly side, if a plate is cast in plaster or resin, the chances are it's a fake!

I've looked at EBay auctions and seen what looked to be outstanding bargains on loco plates, only to later see they were well made replicas of no historic value.


glueck@saturn.caps.maine.edu

> Does anyone have a sure-fire method for
> authenticating an original builder's plate
> from a fake one? What sort of imperfections
> should one look for? Any information
> provided is appreciated. Thanks!

> K.R. Bell
> RR Museum of PA

Baldwin plates usually have the Baldwin classification stamped on the back. Our ten-wheeler was Baldwin serial number 53296, June 1920. Stamped in the back of both plates is 10-22D-94, which was the Baldwin classification and series number of our locomotive.
Ron Muldowney, in New Jersey, is one of the leading experts on Builders and Number Plates. His E-mail address is Steamfan@gateway.net

Martyhuck@aol.com

My compliments to everyone who shared their expertise on authenticating builder's plates. I will attempt to apply your wisdom to cataloguing our own collection. Rypn is a superb forum for sharing ideas in our field.

I'm also glad to hear that Ted renewed his membership--way to go Ted!!! We appreciate your support:)

K.R. Bell
RR Museum of PA

> Mr Bell,

> You pose an interesting question. We have
> the same problem in the maritime
> preservation business with ship and engine
> builders plates.

> Photos are usually the answer does it look
> like the other plates issued by the same
> builder?
> Are the materiels correct? Did the company
> usually make them in brass and your plate is
> steel? Watch out!

> It may be different with railroads but in
> the ship side aluminum was never used.

> By the way, I just renewed my membership.
> Thanks for your good work. TM


http://rrmuseumpa.org