Go to the Huckleberry RR in Flint, Michigan. Chester Ray Cash is the Master Mechanic. He started out as a track worker, qualified as Fireman, then Engineer. He left the Huck to work at the Henry Ford as a Steam Locmotive Specialist, then came back as Master Mechanic. Mike Booker is a Fireman, I hired him in 2005 and he's still there. What we have said is that race doesn't matter - we look for people who are responsible.

One of the cities and cultural relationships that I've admired the most is Savannah, GA. The roundhouse railroad museum down there (Savannah Coastal Heritage Society) has a strong link to the Savannah College of Art and Design (SCAD), and not only does the college occupy historic rail buildings, but a tremendous amount of architectural rehab has been accomplished by students of all races and backgrounds that otherwise would have NO exposure to rail history. It's a brick-by-brick grind down there, but it has happened in no small measure due to that relationship, and the students I've seen working down there mirror the community at large. The roundhouse is just one of their projects, but the car shop restoration is just a mammoth project, and it wouldn't happen without these relationships.

And the city management - that also sponsored the River St. streetcar project - are no less diverse, a great group. From the mayor to the managers, they love their trains and tracks. And they know their rail history.

I can't necessarily directly connect steam with that effort - but if you're looking for a community and a model to research and emulate to see how to bring in a young and multi-ethnic population into preservation and volunteerism, with actual results, you could do a whole lot worse than learn about Savannah. I don't see this board recognizing them very often down there, and I'd like to correct that.

On the (sub) topic of family volunteers...

The organization I usually volunteer with (WW&F) is very family friendly for volunteers. Wives & girlfriends of volunteers are often helping out, and even some women whose husbands are not into railroading are in our regular corps. Children are encouraged (with parental supervision, of course) to help as they can.

Besides all the reasons given previously (and in the other thread about attracting family visitors) I find that for me, choice of language by my fellow volunteers also to be a good reason to stay, or have the kiddies and ladies stay home. While everyone would expect a few choice words to be uttered if someone drops a tie or whatever, a continual barrage of expletives, innuendos, and the like will quickly ruin a family atmosphere.

Wilmington & Western has several volunteers that meet the "minorities agenda" of this subjected thread (ie: non-white and also female). One in particular did the majority of the volunteer leadership work on restoring their 4-4-0# 98 before during and after contractors did their work, including boiler work, welding, and the usual mundane work that goes into restoring a locomotive, and she documented it in a now published book on the W&W. She racked up several THOUSAND hours in just one year working on that engine beating out all of the male volunteers. She also regularly volunteers in engine service (steam and diesel) as well as other capacities. So we're not just talking selling tickets and painting a few handrails here.

There are also a number of YOUNG volunteers training in various services at the W&W that make other operations pale in comparison to attracting them.

I have also seen at Strasburg, a few minorities working in Engine service over the recent years.

It's rare, but they rae out there. Organizations do need to do a better job in attracting them, but at the same time, NO MAKE THEM FEEL LIKE THEY'RE ON STAGE!
(which I realize I sorda did here, but it is only to validate a point, not to earn political props)

That was an issues I experienced years ago at a RR operation with both a female volunteer and a African American. They were both pushed too far, too fast by the BOD and Operations Managers in an attempt to look "poltically correct" and it turned the volunteers off very quickly.

Can I second the "they're not on display" comment? That's why I mentioned looking through pictures you already have to avoid the "gee, whiz, we have a minority here!" shot.

As far as language goes, it's always good to tone it down (or cuss in something besides English.) I grew up around coal miners, and they're not real restrained, so even though I don't cuss a lot, when I do it's kind of, er...foul. I'd be more concerned about swearing in front of little kids than teenagers or other women. When women my age (I'm 52) started into workplaces with mostly men, one of the hurdles was not making the guys feel awkward when they dropped something and said what came naturally.

Ross,

Are you sure that a job where a decent living depended for many, many years on the amount of tips one received can be referred to as a "good paying job"? Remember it wasn't until the last stages of the Pullman era that Pullman porters, lounge car attendants, etc., began to be paid a living wage.

The history of black Americans in the railroad industry is a disgrace as it relates to their treatment by management and the unions. For years management and union colluded to keep blacks from holding positions of importance on the railroads. From "non-promotable" firemen (at the unions' insistence) to the white-only crafts of freight/passenger/Pullman conductor, dining car steward, and skilled shop workers, racism was pervasive throughout the industry. Even as late as the formation of Amtrak, the trainman's union on the Santa Fe refused to give brakeman's seniority to those who had held jobs as Porter-Brakeman. This was the main factor in the decisive defeat of the United Transportation Union's 1986 attempt to replace the Amtrak Service Workers' Council as the union representing Amtrak's on-board service employees.

What does this all have to do with the subject at hand? Perhaps if black Americans had a level playing field in the railroad industry and were not subject to outright racial discrimination in hiring/promoting, there would be many more black railfans today, thus more with an interest in volunteering at museums and learning the crafts that their grandfathers could not be hired for.

Jim Tatum.

Without stirring up an acrimonious sociological and political discussion here, may I point out the recent well-selling book by Larry Tye: Rising from the Rails: Pullman Porters and the Making of the Black Middle Class:

http://www.amazon.com/Rising-Rails-Pull ... 371&sr=8-2

The book covers both sides of the debate Brothers Rowland and Tatum seem headed towards. Bluntly put and overly summarized: Yes, African-Americans were treated little better than house servants by the railroad industry for decades; but consider their alternatives and what all that employment eventually did for their long-term plight, economically.

I've noticed that a lot of state-backed rail museums in the past decade have done exhibits, or backed papers or the like, on African-Americans in the railroad industry. For a while it was the "flavor of the month" among the more "academic" railroad writers. And why? Well, it's long overdue, of course, but it's also a form of outreach to a formerly ignored group of potential visitors. (And, if you're a Limbaugh/etc. listener, maybe a sop to the "politically correct" crowd.)

I might note that, in a lot of libraries I've visited or checked out, the Tye book is the only railroad book (aside from books like the latest Thomas the Tank Engine storybook) that some libraries have bought since Stephen Ambrose's Nothing Like It In the World in 2001. This could engender an entirely separate discussion as to why railroads have been ignored by public libraries or publishers, but I've probably caused enough trouble for now..........

Ironically, it was just a matter of timing, as the same young fellow who was operating a traction engine ( and also the 30" Shay sometimes ) at R&T, also is working his way up at Strasburg. He just wasn't there that day.

Admittedly, it would be great to have more minorities involved. It has already been mentioned that we should harass and harangue all of our aquaintences to come out and get involved.

As a kid, I watched a show about a little blue engine featuring a lilliputian former Beatle and a veteran African-American chief engineer named Harry, who occupied the biggest office in the whole joint and would sit around telling stories of the high iron. The African-American later gave way to a Native American, Billy Twofeathers (and, of course, the former Beatle to a brilliantly foul-mouthed comedian—may he rest in peace).

The first railroad I ever worked for was run by a woman. Not only that, she ran two of them! Her daughter fired steam to the satisfaction of the old SP heads, and the railroad has employed at least two other fairer-sex firefolk since then. In my experience at three volunteer outfits over the years, I've encountered even more, and honestly can't think of any minority not represented. One of the coolest things is seeing couples out every weekly workday. Doug Debs and Laura Bajuk at Niles Canyon/GGRM are a great example of a shared passion for preservation (and generously ensuring the battalions are well fed).

I guess what I'm trying to say is, it's out there. Sure, I'm from a diverse, socially-progressive metropolitan area not too representative of everywhere else in the country and have grown accustomed to the laid back "whatever goes" California attitude, but I thought equality was about removing lines altogether, not singling out a Latino or Asian-American crew member from traditional "old white guy" archetype. I think Marty is on the mark; paid or volunteer, it's about who's qualified and responsible, and little else beyond that matters.

Bottom line: just be welcoming and make the work seem as appealing...err, rewarding...as possible and I think all will be pleasantly surprised.

Well,I guess I will chime in here and offer a few comments. A few of you have personally met me and can attest that I am an African American,born into a railroad family,and have run, fired,and maintained steam locomotives since 1984. I will tell you that all has not been rosy,but each experience has made me better. I was fortunate enough to have a grandfather who fired steam and, for a time,ran steam on a logging line in Northern Arizona when most African Americans were barred from running a steam locomotive. My desire to go railroading was fueled by those men and their brothers,one of whom was a Pullman porter. When I do run steam I still wear one of my grandfathers' caps in homage to him. So some it was quite a surprise for someone to hear a chime whistle and find me at the throttle! Would I love to see more minorities in the cab? Absolutely. Would I love to see more of them involved across the board? Would I love an opportunity to run on a Class One with steam? You bet I would. This is a part of our shared history. African Americans who were railroaders made better wages than just about any other occupation that was open to us,and gave rise to the black middle class.

I also think that some sort of outreach program would be able to pull more minorities into this industry we all love. The more we have of everyone,the stronger we all are. In some communities,good role models are hard to come by and there aren't much better ones than locomotive engineers.

Media also plays a part in what the perception of what minorities can do in this business. We have to work on those aspects of our industry, anddraw thos kids in who can weld, do the woodwork,etc...all the things it takes to make the wheels go round.

I am glad that this subject came up,and glad it is being discussed,and hopefully,between all of us,we can find a way to bring more inclusion for everybody. As I said before,this history belongs to all of us.

Wow, am I putting two and two together and maybe figuring out your grandfather worked for Southwest Lumber in Flagstaff? If true, email me, particularly if there are any photos & stories of that era. I've got the Shuppert book on the operation and have spent time wandering around the old grades there.

Heck when I was in high school I was the one kid who volunteered at a railroad muesum in the whole school. Talk about a minority! Yes I am white anglo saxon & Prot. but I was the only steam person in school. Even the car guy's made fun of me.

In this day & age we need all the help we can get!

DBH

From left to right: Clive Catchpole, David Ricky Sims, Marty Knox, Chester Ray Cash, Terry Hunt, Mike Horton(rear). Picture by Jim Wrinn, October, 2005.

Heck yes, Jim Tatum it was a VERY good job if you were amongst the tens of thousands of black men in the post Civil War south with no employment, living a hand to mouth subsistence life with no economic means to support yourself or a family.

Along comes this chance to earn a cash living, learn a trade, eat decent food, enjoy the pleasures of running water, sanitation, heat in the cold weather AND be able to send cash home to the family which had none!!

The position of Sleeping Car Porter was looked up to througout the black community as a position of opportunity and nearly all those fortunate to get one of the coveted jobs persued it with dedication and stayed at it until late in their lives.

It is a fact of history that this enabled tens of thousands of black families to migrate to Chicago and other northern cities and thus escape the oppressive lives they led.

I'd say that's a heck of a positive story!!

Ross Rowland

Ross - I agree that it IS a positive story and one that rail museums should be proud to tell. What is also interesting is that the wife and I have taken a number of trips using sleeping cars on Amtrak the last few years and we are as likely to get a white male sleeping car attendant, or a white female or a black female as we are a black male. One story that has really come full circle!

Les