That's simply short-sightedness on the part of the museum however if you base your decision on "vintage" steam train ride. Your "Mom, Dad and 2 Kids", who are making up the vast majority of your attendance, don't know and could care less about the heritage of the steam engine. It's simply a steam engine, and they will automatically assume it's old because they don't see many of them around. Only the railfans will know and care, and the vast majority of them aren't visiting and supporting your museum anyway.

You're talking about engines that are in good shape, are small enough to operate at your museum, strong enough to power most anything you'd want to put behind them, very economical on coal/water, and comparatively cheap to acquire.
Kevin

Dave Wantz has been working on the SY at Essex for about a year, now. He recently completed work on the driving boxes and is now starting the rebuild of the engine truck. Apparently this truck had been damaged in some kind of accident and needs a significant amount of TLC to get it back in shape. He called a couple of days ago to say that they were doing an initial, unofficial hydro this week. He said they had some leaky tubes, but not too bad for the first fill-up. They hope to get the boiler buttoned up and do it for real when the FRA inspector is there for the No. 40's annual inspection.

Just for the record, they still do exist, and they do answer emails - I was checking up on some components about six months ago:

http://www.multipowerinternational.com/

JDC is the person to contact on just how different a stock SY is vs. the surplus collection that is referred to here.

Having been over to Kane after the enginehouse burned and seen the K&K's demise, I was delighted that anybody anywhere took this on, when it seemed like it could be headed for a remelt furnace. I know my very first impressions of it on the K&K were how QUIET it was - everything was so new and tight, nothing rattled, nothing clanked... like wow, that's right, steam locomotives were NEW products at one time.

Just because a Chinese locomotive is younger doesn't mean it's in better shape than something in a park. The Chinese did not build their steam locomotives to the same standards that North American builders. I've seen the Corman QJ up close when he ran it, and the best way to describe the engineering on the QJ is, "just good enough." North American builders most likely overbuilt the engines to last 40-50 years in service, whereas Chinese built the locomotives to run 10-20 years. The QJ (and I imagine most other Chinese survivors) were used beyond their planned lifespan.

While you may be able to purchase a running SY for $300,000, you still have to pay for shipping on a boat, shipping by rail, then a crane to unload it at your place, and if you plan to Americanize the engine there's an additional cost. We are talking close to $700-750,000 to have a running Americanized Chinese Locomotive. A park engine in decent shape could be restored for about the same money, IMHO.

The merits or lack thereof of Chinese metallurgy aside, we have a few folks on this forum with first-hand experience along those lines. I'm certain they would beg to differ with your "HO" on the costs of restoring a park locomotive--in 2011 dollars, at least.

Besides which, if you're factoring in shipping, cranes, etc. for the Chinese loco, you also have to factor in cranes, shipping, removal from the park, etc. for the park locomotive.

Well I never said it would be a top notch restoration, just something you could run at 10-15mph. :-)

there are a few problems with this theory...

#1...the number of park engines that you could actually get that are in decent shape are not nearly as many as there were 30 years ago. Most of the easy candidates for restoration were re-acquired. That leaves a bunch of basket cases, or engines where the park doesn't want to let them go.

#2...with the increased regulations after the Gettysburg crown sheet failure (and a few non-railroad boiler explosions), you are still talking big bucks. The days of "patch her up, get her running, and we'll deal with the rest later" are long gone--and that's a good thing if you want to see operable steam in 20-30 years.

As far as Americanizing, the general tourist doesn't care. Knox & Kane did very well with that SY for years, as did Susquehanna when they had 142. I seriously doubt an American engine would draw any more people to Iowa than the still very authentic JS on the Boone & Scenic Valley. Any Americanizing expenses will not pay for themselves, and will only serve the desires of the membership base.

There are cases for both rebuilding and importing, and what works in one location may not work at the next. To automatically discount importing a low-use engine in good condition without doing the research to see how the costs stack up is narrow-minded, however.
Kevin

Americanization (other than FRA compliance) does not change the operational nature of the locomotive. You could always wait until the opportunity presented itself (need to do tender repairs, etc.)

The Valley RR didn't Americanize their original SY when it arrived, and had the K&K loco been in non-fire damaged shape, they may not have this time around. What we are seeing is a unique opportunity, and I for one am very happy to see the capable hands of Mr. Conrad and others at VRR at the head of this.

I completely agree with this. I was just trying to point out that importing a Chinese locomotive isn't always going to significantly cheaper.

IAS is selling their QJ's, Why?
Or are they still for sale? They where brought over as a test to see if they could be flipped?

Having been the project manager for the three imported QJs that are here in The USA a few words on importing Chinese locomotive. One of the big advange of the imported Chinese locomotive was that they were rebuilt locomotives or all the machinery was overhauled to a standard, and the boilers were repaired and retubed with new material in china at a great cost saving over doing the work in the USA. Some of the work was very good and some only fair depending on the repair factory . Now in China steam locomotive repair factories are almost all closed and China Rail makes it very difficult to move locomotives on the own wheels.
Presently based on my knowledge its still possible to obtain a used QJ,JS, or SY and have it rebuilt in China and sent someone to inspect and do the FRA work there. Cost to USA site would be in the $350,000 to $650,000 that would get someone a rebuilt FRA locomotive but it still would be some minor repairs to make it a really good locomotive, So far the overhauls of appliances have be poor but the boiler and machinery work is good. Sea freight on a locomotive from China to the USA is about $70,000 which I included in MY estimate for the total cost . If anyone is interest please contact me.
Based on my 40 years working on steam locomotives I would guess the average park locomotive today is going to cost $500.000 to $1,000,000 . Just last year the Serria #3 was 1.5 million with the new boiler. Cost of locomotive rebuilds vary widely based on labor cost and in house skills and facilities

Dennis,

Very interesting! What kind of work has to be done to a locomotive in China to bring it up to FRA compliance? I remember reading that one item was attaching the grab irons with bolts, rather than welding them to the locomotive.

Also, how fesable would it be to convert a Chinese import to right-hand drive?