Can You Get There Without a Car?

Higherspeedrailnow · **Joined:** Wed Aug 13, 2008 2:09 am **Posts:** 130

Randy Hees wrote:

Ardenwood Farm, home of the SPCRR is served by a couple of AC Transit Bus lines, but they let you off at the front gate, a half mile walk parking lot, the railroad and other activities, a intentional buffer separating the farm from the street.

The Niles Canyon Railway has both bus and occasional (very occasional) cross platform transfer in Niles, now that added a stop there.

I recently visited Hawaii, and was surprised at how well served the Hawaiian Railway Society site at Ewa was by public transit.

San Francisco’s cable car museum is served by two cable car lines… which stop just feet from the front door.

Of course, in the far west, there are some sites that are nearly impossible… Nevada Northern at Ely, located on US 50, marketed as America’s Most Lonely Highway, or the Cumbres and Toltec, In a very remote part of Colorado and New Mexico.

So many sites are in weird remote places, located there ether because they are preserving a historic site, line or right of way, or more often because the land was chosen because it was cheap, and it was cheap because it was remote.

Join the local group, make a donation, based on them giving you a ride to the line. Try to avoid hotels that don't have van services, or will NOT pick you up at a rail stations. But will take people to the airport 50 miles away.

dinwitty · **Joined:** Wed Oct 22, 2008 8:18 pm **Posts:** 2226

Alexander D. Mitchell IV wrote:

The topic of gasoline prices and visitorship raises (again) an important question:

Can you possibly get there without a car?

Many British excursion railways and museums make a point of interconnectivity. None of my British friends can possibly understand why there isn't an interchange station between Amtrak/SEPTA and the Strasburg at Leaman Place. If at all possible, British (and many European) excursion lines offer cross-platform connections at real passenger stations with regular passenger trains. I was even able to hop local buses from BR stations to remote lines like the Kent & East Sussex and Bluebell in 1991.

But in America? Load up the car. This is a consideration not just for visitors, but for potential volunteers and staffers as well.

Random search and first-hand knowledge:

Baltimore Streetcar Museum and B&O Museum: both within walking distance of regular transit and free-downtown- circulator-shuttle bus stops; one can walk from Amtrak/MARC's Penn Station to the BSM but it's not very obvious or pedestrian-friendly, or ride from Penn Station to B&O Museum free via circulator buses. And you can get downtown via Light Rail from the major airport.

Wilmington & Western: Adjacent to a major DART bus line (#6) between Wilmington (Amtrak Station!) & Newark, but Sunday service is experimental and subject to discontinuance (heck, it's an improvement from when I was there, when they only operated on the Sundays when the buses didn't run!).

Ellicott City: Out of luck

National Capital Trolley Museum: Has a local transit bus connecting with a subway terminal every 30 minutes on weekends.

Western Md. Scenic RR, Cumberland: You can certainly get there by Amtrak, but it's a short hike or taxi ride between the two stations, and a heck of a lag between rides unless you come in from the west and return west.......

Strasburg/RR Museum of Pa.: You can get a bus from Lancaster to Paradise, but not to Strasburg.

Altoona: the Railroaders Memorial Museum is an easy hike from the Amtrak/bus station.

East Broad Top/Rockhill Trolley Museum: an admittedly extreme case of "load up the car."

Wanamaker, Kempton & Southern: ditto.......

You can ask a taxi to go anywhere, but thats expensive. Various areas have a dial-a-ride service which is around here. Years ago somebody rode from New York to Chicago via 100% interurban/electric/streetcar. Not possible today. We have become a car society.

S Bartlett · **Joined:** Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:26 pm **Posts:** 51

Shelburne Falls Trolley Museum and the local Franklin Regional Transit Authority share a stop in Buckland. But they only run week days, and we only run weekends, so unless you come on a Monday in July or August (our extended summer schedule), the layover is pretty tough. Once Amtrak comes to Greenfield we'll have a FRTA connection to Amtrak there.

p51 · **Posted:** Tue Apr 26, 2011 11:34 pm

This is a good topic, but I don’t know if the British mindset will plug into American realities. Having been to the UK and most of the EU nations, I know that RR passenger service is much more common. But then again, it’s common to find a European who doesn’t own or a car (or regularly rides in one). Some European countries are the size of individual states in the US. They also tax the living heck out of their citizens to pay for all that rail service.
I'm not sure I'd go to a RR attraction by Amtrak, as I have to drive just to get to the station, then deal with parking and worry if someone broke into my ride while I was gone.

Higherspeedrailnow · **Joined:** Wed Aug 13, 2008 2:09 am **Posts:** 130

p51 wrote:

This is a good topic, but I don’t know if the British mindset will plug into American realities. Having been to the UK and most of the EU nations, I know that RR passenger service is much more common. But then again, it’s common to find a European who doesn’t own or a car (or regularly rides in one). Some European countries are the size of individual states in the US. They also tax the living heck out of their citizens to pay for all that rail service.
I'm not sure I'd go to a RR attraction by Amtrak, as I have to drive just to get to the station, then deal with parking and worry if someone broke into my ride while I was gone.

Make sure your car is empty, or contents are not in view. Years ago, there were problerms at a dinner train operation. Cars were broke into while the train was gone. It was not in a bad area. Just a small town. So it can happen anywhere, anytime. In the US they tax the living heck out of us for highways. Who do you think pays for all the parking lots and their lighting, cleaning, snow removal, property taxes and up keep at stores and shopping malls? If you don't pay in taxes you'll pay in prices.

Randy Gustafson · **Posted:** Wed Apr 27, 2011 8:24 am

Have to put a plug in for the Adirondack, as not only can you get there without a car, it's a cross-platform Amtrak transfer for the Utica trains.

http://adirondackrr.com/adkrr_utica.php

Having done the Utica-Thendara run a few times, I'd also recommend throwing in the boat cruise up on the Fulton Chain...

Ellis' proposal for the Upper Hudson includes operations out of the Saratoga, NY Amtrak station.

It's a bit catch-as-catch can, but I'm pretty sure transportation can be arranged between Amtrak and the Grand Canyon Railroad, with the shuttle bus at the hotel in Williams. That's a remarkable long-distance no-car possibility, with a destination.

Certainly not all Amtrak stations are created equal for parking security. Some of my favorites are the secondary, not downtown, stations, and every one is a different situation. In this area, Altoona (parking ramp), Depew, NY (free lot near airport). There are still places that there's absolutely no way I'd leave my car overnight. Pittsburgh used to have a secure ramp across from the station but you had to go through the bus depot to get to it and that was...hmmm....

Les Beckman · **Joined:** Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm **Posts:** 6482

Offhand, I can't think of any of the midwestern museums that have a way to get to them without using a private vehicle. This includes HVRM in North Judson, Indiana; IRM in Union, Illinois; ITM in Noblesville, Indiana; INRM in French Lick, Indiana; KRM in New Haven, Kentucky; WV in Connersville, Indiana; MCRM in North Freedom, Wisconsin; LRRR in Coldwater, Michigan; MRM in Monticello, Illinois and BGRM in Versailles, Kentucky.

I heard at one time, that IRM was considering using one of their diesel powered trains (perhaps the Nebraska Zephyr?) to run from Chicago out to Union in the morning and then return to Chicago in later afternoon. Or perhaps only running the train from the Elgin terminus of METRA out to the museum. Either way, it seemed like a good idea to me. But perhaps I have it wrong and IRM never really considered such an operation. Or maybe it was looked in to, and not considered viable.

Les

Randy Gustafson · **Posted:** Wed Apr 27, 2011 11:58 am

I'm not sure it would really qualify as a "railroad museum" but there is an equipment display at a couple Amtrak stations....

Harrisburg has the GG-1 and the PRR caboose...

Utica has the NYC 0-6-0, and the other equipment that is now offered for sale at the Childrens's Museum is just across the parking lot.

Kansas City has the KCS F-units behind the science center, and usually a collection of private cars in storage, and a PCC under a roof.

The Altoona Railroader's Museum is directly accessible from the Amtrak station and is across the tracks with an overhead pedestrian crossing. That's a very legit railroad museum accessible by Amtrak. The May 2011 Amtrak schedule for the Pennsylvanian still allows this to work with a 7:20 AM departure from Pittsburgh, 10AM arrival in Altoona, all day in Altoona (and you can railfan quite well from the museum site), and a 5PM departure headed back west. With two daylight moves over the curve plus the museum..put this one on your list.

tomgears · **Posted:** Wed Apr 27, 2011 12:06 pm

Just last week I went to the Chicago Museum of Science and Industry by taking Amtrak to Chicago and the #10 bus (Metra) to the museum. Last winter I visited the California State Railroad Museum using public transit.

As Sandy mentioned Wilmington and Western is on the DART #6 bus route, but both of us remember riding there on bicycle back in the early 1980's.

Les Beckman · **Joined:** Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm **Posts:** 6482

tomgears wrote:

Just last week I went to the Chicago Museum of Science and Industry by taking Amtrak to Chicago and the #10 bus (Metra) to the museum. Last winter I visited the California State Railroad Museum using public transit.

Tom -

You could have used the METRA Electric line (ex-Illinois Central) to the 57th Street station and then had a short 2 block walk over to the MofS&I. But then again, maybe you prefer buses!

Les

Les Beckman · **Joined:** Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm **Posts:** 6482

Randy Gustafson wrote:

I'm not sure it would really qualify as a "railroad museum" but there is an equipment display at a couple Amtrak stations....

Randy -

CB&Q Hudson #3001 is displayed at the Ottumwa, Iowa Amtrak station but it is around the front of the station, and not visible from the train or platform. If you have a longer stop than scheduled (check with your conductor), you might be able to photograph the engine and make it back to the train before its departure.

Les

tomgears · **Posted:** Wed Apr 27, 2011 2:55 pm

Les,

Had I known I would have taken the train. I was at Navy Pier and everyone told me that was the quickest way. I also saw the NYC Mohawk when we rolled through Elkhart.

Les Beckman · **Joined:** Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm **Posts:** 6482

tomgears wrote:

Les,

Had I known I would have taken the train. I was at Navy Pier and everyone told me that was the quickest way. I also saw the NYC Mohawk when we rolled through Elkhart.

Tom -

If you come through at night on Amtrak, you will see that the 3001 has its headlight and markers lit. Almost as if it is waiting to take a freight out of the yard! Quite a nice impression.

Incidentally, you could obviously exit Amtrak there and walk over to the museum. So another place that you can reach without a car.

Les

Frank Hicks · **Posted:** Wed Apr 27, 2011 3:22 pm

Les Beckman wrote:

I heard at one time, that IRM was considering using one of their diesel powered trains (perhaps the Nebraska Zephyr?) to run from Chicago out to Union in the morning and then return to Chicago in later afternoon.

I don't think that this was every seriously looked into - it just wouldn't be very economically viable. If something along these lines were to be planned, most likely it would involve IRM's set of C&NW bi-level cars due to their capacity, relatively current design, and the compatibility (I think?) of the F7's with current Metra signalling. But the bi-level cars need work and I suspect insurance costs would be astronomical. Using a modern Metra train set would be easier but my guess is that insurance would still be a deal killer. The UP has run passenger specials out to IRM, though, the most recent being about a week or so ago.

Dennis Storzek · **Posted:** Wed Apr 27, 2011 3:56 pm

Les Beckman wrote:

I heard at one time, that IRM was considering using one of their diesel powered trains (perhaps the Nebraska Zephyr?) to run from Chicago out to Union in the morning and then return to Chicago in later afternoon. Or perhaps only running the train from the Elgin terminus of METRA out to the museum. Either way, it seemed like a good idea to me. But perhaps I have it wrong and IRM never really considered such an operation. Or maybe it was looked in to, and not considered viable.

Les

It was talked about in the early seventies, shortly after the Zephyr trainset arrived, but as far as I know that's all it was, just talk. As in, "Wouldn't it be cool if we..." At that time the E-5 didn't even run, and the C&NW track was atrocious. Over the years those things got fixed, but then other problems became evident, so I don't know if it was ever given SERIOUS consideration.

And still, there is no connection with the former Milwaukee Road line that Metra uses into Elgin... there is a short stretch where the MILW and C&NW parallel, on the same grade, about 100' apart, but there is no connection, and no platforms to effect a passenger transfer. Meanwhile, the end of the Belvidere branch in West Chicago has had the connection facing the city removed years ago, so an excursion from North Western Station downtown would have to change ends at West Chicago to continue to Union. It has been done as a special move using Metra equipment several times over the years, but I don't think there is enough market potential to try to do it on a regular basis.

One never does know what the future might hold, however. I think it's only a matter of time (likely measured in decades) before Metra expands service outward again past Elgin, and I presume they will put the possible connection in so as to be able to serve fast growing Huntly, which is only six or seven miles from the IRM campus. At that point, depending upon where Metra puts their station, direct service may become viable.