Photos of this 2-8-0, on display at Mason City, Iowa. Asbestos lagging removed, but little else in repairs or restoration.

http://eldora.net/lyndon/locos/steam457.html
ryarger@rypn.org

Rather pretty little 2-8-0, with classic lines. A Boy Scout troop or other civic minded group needs to scrape her down and put primer and black paint to her, particularly around the smokebox. It would be nice to arrest any corrosion at this point, since her size would make her a nice restoration candidate. I'm wondering what her innards look like. I'm betting her cab is stripped clean.

glueck@saturn.caps.maine.edu

> It would be nice to arrest any corrosion at this point

It would be nice to arrest the scum that stole the builders plate off one side of the loco- notice the Alco builder plate shaped rust mark on the smokebox- looks recently gone or it would be more weathered. E-Bay fodder ?

staybolt@bellsouth.net

I often wonder what happens to the builders plates that are stolen from various locomotives.
I figure that they're molding away in these dirt
bags' basements. After all, to whom and where can they be shown? I suspect that these things then get thrown out by the heirs who don't know what the stuff. Should we offer amnesty, and get these things back to their rightful owners? Well,
of course if these lowlives can even read! Then again, maybe you'd be surprised who has what!

It would be nice to arrest the scum that
> stole the builders plate off one side of the
> loco- notice the Alco builder plate shaped
> rust mark on the smokebox- looks recently
> gone or it would be more weathered. E-Bay
> fodder ?


schwartzsj@juno.com

TWM Long, late owner of the Reader RR, always said, in Southern, senetorial tones, "The vereh ones that get teuhs in their eyes when they hear the whistle blow are the vereh ones that'll steal the plates off the engine as soon as you get her parked."

> TWM Long, late owner of the Reader RR,
> always said, in Southern, senetorial tones,
> "The vereh ones that get teuhs in their
> eyes when they hear the whistle blow are the
> vereh ones that'll steal the plates off the
> engine as soon as you get her parked."
Sadly there is truth to that; my only response is to say that true railfans are not theives. A true railfan takes a great picture, helps out or supports the organization that put the engine there for them to admire, and takes their kids out to see the trains. When some alleged railfans steal, in reality they are stealing from themselves and everyone else who comes to see the train. Once I asked an engineer why some of the lesser used engines were not out where pictures could be taken, he replied that they were concerned about theft, when I remarked that it was terrible they had to worry about it the engineer looked at me in a way that said "how do I know you wouldn't steal from us?". That glance stuck with me, it made me angry that a few greedy scumbags had led the staff to suspect all railfans.

> Once I asked an engineer why
> some of the lesser used engines were not out
> where pictures could be taken, he replied
> that they were concerned about theft, when I
> remarked that it was terrible they had to
> worry about it the engineer looked at me in
> a way that said "how do I know you
> wouldn't steal from us?". That glance
> stuck with me, it made me angry that a few
> greedy scumbags had led the staff to suspect
> all railfans.

While it's quite true, railroad employees themselves are not above supplementing their income with sales of items off locomotives. I remember a hostler mentioning that he sold an operating manual to an SD-38 to a "fan". And, I was propositioned to buy brass throttle and reverser handles from an "employee" at E'Port.
Of course there is the tale that the great Mike
Eagleson (had a steam column in Railroad Magazine)
who was caught in the act at Strasburg stealing a builder's plate!



schwartzsj@juno.com

Do any of the C&TSR gents here know what the replicas that the friends sold cost to produce? If the cost is low enough, perhaps we could sell enough replicas to reduce demand for the originals. If we can flood the market, maybe that will stop the thieves and bring much needed revenue to the people trying to protect that which the builders plates represent.
Sincerely,
David Ackerman


david_ackerman@yahoo.com

Hate to say it but the best idea may be to put the originals under lock and key and fit the engine with a replica, selling replicas is not a bad idea either. Its a slippery slope though, what else is "too collectable to risk using" the bell, the whistle? Any engine left unguarded even overnight risks the theft of any part that an ill intentioned person can remove with hand tools. No easy answers.

One of the first things I did when I got here to our museum was take off the builder's plates (circa 1878) and bell on our 2-4-0 Porter. While the D.B. isn't out in the open, it can be seen through our temporary storage behind our building, and that always seems to be just enough to attract some thieves. I even used security hardware to attach the boiler plates and bell in the display inside, for added pre-caution. This has worked well on some of our "collectibles" on our combine as well. While it still amounts to a screw with a difficult to use and remove head, someone, if they had enough enough time, MIGHT be able to pry it off, but not without attracting a whole lot of attention (the combine is in a VERY ppublic display area). As with any item that someone tries to steal, I've found that adding a serious "time factor" to removal takes care of 90% of the problem.

My favorite tactic is still Jerry Jacobsens at Ohio Central. From what I've heard, each one of his replica builders plates is stamped on the back with "Stolen from the Ohio Central R.R." Now that's thinkin'!

TJG

> Hate to say it but the best idea may be to
> put the originals under lock and key and fit
> the engine with a replica, selling replicas
> is not a bad idea either. Its a slippery
> slope though, what else is "too
> collectable to risk using" the bell,
> the whistle? Any engine left unguarded even
> overnight risks the theft of any part that
> an ill intentioned person can remove with
> hand tools. No easy answers.


Port Huron Museum

tjgaffney@phmuseum.org

The replica plates on the 480's date from before I went to work there, so I cannot comment on thier price. When 463 was restored we had plates cast for less than $100 each if I recall. Employees could buy them at cost, retail was a bunch more. All the replicas have a flat milled on the back with "REPLICA # 00" stamped into them. 463's original plates vanished back in the 1920's, so the originals are probably long gone.

As an aside to this, 20+ years ago when we put 489 in service I contacted the person who had the original builders plates off her and asked if we could use them on the engine or use them for molds to make copies. I got a very terse and nasty reply to the negative. We later installed copies.

In Dec 1968 when the last train ran all the D&RGW power still had builders plates and most still had class lights. By Sept 1970 all the plates and lights had vanished.

On whistles and bells: don't put a shut off valve under the whistle, it makes it kinda hard to steal when the engine is hot. You could beat over the end of the bell mouning studs, but when you need to get it off, it's a bunch tougher. At least a bell is a lot tougher to get off by yourself.

THAT my friends is the sad tryth....
How many here have "liberated" a stack of paper, some bits of hardware, or even more from work? Isn't that theft?

-OR-

How many work on personal stuff, or access this board on company time? Isn't that theft too?

I suppose that we could split hairs and argue the historical value degree (those little pilferings quickly add up to more than the value of a little piece of brass), but then IMO its just human nature that most of us will rationalise our own actions while being quick to condemn others.

Of all the major and minor thefts at our local antique agricultural machinery club which were solved, about 2/3 were inside jobs by members or their immediate families....unfortunately only about 10% were ever solved, so that may, or may not, be a representative sample.