"You cannot complete your posting that you spend an hour on, because the thread is locked."
GRRRRRRRRR.

Person A: I'm sick of hearing about this.
Person B: So stop reading it.
Person A: OK.

Person C: I'm sick of hearng about this, so I'll LOCK THE THREAD even though it's active.

The moderation of this forum will be the death of my involvement in it.

I thought Mr. Bailey was no longer a moderator? I thought he had resigned? What violation of the terms of service occurred?

Is this the way we are celebrating Doug's return as moderator, with heavy handed over-moderation?

Why not make Robert and myself moderator? Then we could lock all the threads we don't like reading!

So I guess that makes you person D?

Person D: Okay, it got locked up, so I'll immediately start another thread about why I'm ticked it got locked...

Whether the thread is active or not isn't particularly important. Perhaps I can summarize the thread:

Person A: 643 is going to run again!
Person B: Is not!
Person C: Person B's opinion is wrong
Person D: You're all wrong.

Repeat ad nauseum. What has this to do with railway preservation? I think little or nothing was being served by criticizing Mr. Campbell, however justified, or unjustified it may have been. If someone can explain to me what purpose the thread was surving, beyond argument, ad hominem, and opinion flogging, I'll be happy to reopen it.

Actually, I don't think that's a half bad idea. Let me discuss it with the other moderators. I had resigned. At David's request, I'm back.

I thought Mr. Bailey was no longer a moderator? I thought he had resigned? What violation of the terms of service occurred?

Is this the way we are celebrating Doug's return as moderator, with heavy handed over-moderation?

Why not make Robert and myself moderator? Then we could lock all the threads we don't like reading!


Here, here.

FWIW I agree with Doug that the same silly points were being made over and over again. That doesn't mean, however, that a new point that isn't silly might not be raised. I'm sorry the timing was premature for Robert's entry...he has something interesting to say in his posts, usually.......as do David W, Superheater, and Mr Rowland. I'm actually surprised it went on as long as it did before the plug got pulled. I see no profit in allowing repeated useless perspectives to be posted on this forum. So, eliminating the silly posts.....and silly posters? Difficult to provide.

The local current information is also worthy of posting. Rick knows more about making heavy metal move than anybody.....valuable perspectives there too.

I'd be pleased to see Robert and David moderate - fewer threads about what color of paint and somebody elses machines that NEED to run. More about the realities of the business from a realistic perspective,from people who have specialized knowledge and therefore opinions WORTH reading.

If we can add some antifoam to the boiler......the trip will be a happier one for the passengers as well as the crew. Too many good people are weaning themselves away from the increasingly less worthy information posted here.

dave

I'm the one who got it locked for having nothing constructive apparently. Oh well. I wanted to say that steaminfo said that since the page I linked was affiliated with a certain person besides Glenn that I saw, then he redacted the name and replaced it with acquaintance. I just want to know who that person is (I did see the name) and why it seems like it was a bad sign.

As long as ideas are on the table I suggest a Kickstarter fund to get the paint needed to stabilize the engine. This means cosmetic. Not operational status. You can look at the locked thread for more information since I'm not going to bother repeating it just so another thread can be locked.

I warned everyone that discussing the 643 was taboo!

Robertmacdowell is absolutely correct in that heavy handed moderation is going to kill this forum. Many including I would argue that it already has effectively died as a place where good conversations about railroad preservation can take place. We are so afraid of moderators shutting down threads that we don't stick our necks out any more to discuss a controversial topic. So what if there is a little bit of circular reasoning and repetition going on. One of the things you learn about Internet forums is how to separate the wheat from the chaff. There are nuggets of real info. in these threads. You just have to let them run their course.

Doug, when are you going back into retirement? Your return merely to restart the heavy handed moderation is not needed.

Thanks Doug for returning as some of these circular fireing squads have gotten totally out of hand.

Your helping bring some decorum back is most needed and welcome.


Ross Rowland

Oh God, here it goes.

I won't criticize the moderator. I will say that telling people they are "foamers" or "too optimistic" just because they won't accept doom and defeatism as the only representation of rational thought is a good reason to close a discussion. The last I knew, so long as you weren't baiting someone or defaming somebody, you could still offer and opinion. We have enough of that in this forum. Discussing the desire to preserve a locomotive and arguing varied points of view should be allowed if new opinions are being developed.

I guess I didn't see anything wrong with the previous thread.

So, what has anybody heard about the restoration of the K4s? :-)

In politics--both the government kind and the interpersonal kind--the "answer" that is usually chosen is either the most expedient one or the one that makes the largest number of people (or, more accurately, likely voters) happy.

I've found, however, that the "answer" that leaves the most people DISsatisfied is typically the best/right answer for the public/group good in the long term. If both wings of politics are ticked off at the proposal, then it's probably the best compromise available.

And that, fellow RyPN-ers, is my case for why *I* should be named moderator.



[damn, I shoulda saved that for April 1st.......]

Heavy handed moderation??? May I ask why there have been 742 posts about the 643 during the last 14 years when the status of the locomotive has not changed during those years? Exactly what has been the benefit of those 742 posts?

It's threads like these that have made this forum a laughing stock in the last year.

We have to acknowledge that, no matter how many times we can beat the dead horse to smithereens, someone new is always going to come along and ask the same questions. Furthermore, it doesn't matter how quickly and firmly someone jumps in with "It'sbeendiscussedtodeathrepeatedly, lookhereandhereandhereandhere, nochange..",someone else is like to surface with the repeated "but WHY???" of a little kid. The "sticky" telling folks to look up the subject first will get ignored by most newbies.

We've all been that person at some point. If you think you weren't, you're deluding yourself, and/or you're a member of the "PRR Steam Sunk In Quarries" Facebook page or Yahoo Group.

An inquiry from a "newbie" deserves polite but firm guidance, and a short, one-sentence-to-one-paragraph summary of the status quo. Unless the webmaster wants to write a macro that automatically detects certain locomotive numbers and configure an automatic response to any new topics, we're stuck with this option.

(Be glad I'm not the webmaster. My macro would probably instantly post simply a "Grumpy Cat" NO! picture automatically.)

And we have to acknowledge the possibility, however faint, that someone could well be coming forth with new information. I now know a lot more about B&LE's 643's plight and possibilities after the last thread with aerial views, maps, etc. (It doesn't mean I'm more optimistic; it just means I know what to listen for if the time comes.)

Well, having gone and started the fire, I guess I should explain a little further.

Moderation is much a case of "don't hate the player, hate the game." Humans by nature generate a lot of nonsense. People want to push limits. That has to be dealt with. There's no nice way around that. Moderators are truly in a no-win situation, so we need to yield fair respect accordingly to those who have the gumption. Hats off for coming back. I don't think the moderation is "heavy handed", I have seen that, and that is not this. Not that a certain weight of hand wouldn't be a good thing IMO.

The golden rule of any forum is "contribute good stuff". Or, as elitistjerks.com says, "do not respond to terrible posts". Jerkposting must be actively deterred, and IMO the best deterrence is deletion. Nobody likes their stuff deleted or lock-blocked, trolls and goodposters* alike.

* Trick is, jerkposters are not people, but moods of people who often goodpost too.

Threads don't start good and suddenly become unworthy. Either the thread never belonged on Interchange at the outset (swish gone!) or it does belong and awaits further goodposting. Jerkposting is a direct threat to goodposting. The problem is you have jerkposters on a fast cycle, posting frequently, and valuable contributors visiting perhaps only every couple of days. The effect is a clump of jerkposts at the tail of a thread, making it seem like the thread has 'deteriorated'. Not at all, it's just polluted IMO.

The problem is, locking the thread doesn't remove the jerkposting, it plinths it. The jerkposters are rewarded (no one can retort) and the goodposters are lock-blocked. This results in a perverse incentive, to beat the clock rather than goodpost. Happens to me all the time. I'm intending to goodpost, but I smell the lock coming, so I abstain. I would prefer to edit in confidence whilst 16 messages above me vanish.

And yes, Sandy, we do have to acknowledge the possibility of new information or viewpoints. There are no dead horses, only ineffective approaches taken out of habit and monkey see monkey do. There's always an approach out of left field that no one has tried. I'm still pretty good at that. Nobody yet has talked about this engine from a real estate angle.