From the White Pass discussion group:

WP&YR #61 was not shipped out of Skagway this year as originally planned.
MJ

Posted By: Mid-West Locomotive & Machine Works <greenchili@tds.net>
Date: Wednesday, 15 September 2004, at 12:20 a.m.

Former WP&YR # 61 will have its boiler removed from the frame to prepare for
shipping to Wisconsin next spring. The lift is scheduled for Sept. 16th. A
crew from Mid-West Locomotive & Machine Works has spent the last couple of
days preparing for the lift.


WP&Y 61 is a badly battered hulk of a narrow gauge 2-8-0, that was dumped in the Skagway River in 1949 as rip rap. It and a similar 4-6-0 were dragged out of the river several years ago. Midwest Locomotive & Machine Works is a remnant of the former Kettle Moraine tourist RR in Wisconsin, which now does contract steam repair work.

Photo of it being pulled upright last year:

http://www.whitepassfan.net/whitepass/h ... medium.jpg

What's the goal of the work being done to this engine? Display?

is there a forum member close enough to the "Mid-West Locomotive & Machine Works" to go take measurements of the "back to back" dimensions and the tire widths on that locomotive?

I'm hoping to draw some conclusions from the info gathered from the #61's tires, to be able to accurately predict the dimensions that the D&RGW used on the C-21 tires and wheels.

Just in case it comes up again, the "similar 4-6-0" was long rumored to be either ET&WNC # 10 or 14. I believe it was Tweetsie RR steam guru Frank Coffey who claimed he stood on the remains of either engine in his 50s visit to Skagway to eventually purchase # 190 for the NC park.
All records now show that 10 and 14 were damaged in the 1943 roundhouse fire in Whitehorse; both were scrapped at the Northern Pacific dead line at Auburn, WA after the war.

The WP&YR #61 is the subject of a current thread on the NGDF:

Any work being done on WP&Y 61?

Jump down to the post from "Earl" and get a significant part of the answer.

Prediction of historic information? Interesting....but would it not be easier to work through the Colorado Railroad Museum's archives and collections? Even taking a steel tape out to the displays there would give you a very close comparison.

dave

Thanks Brian,

I read that.

Its the "back to back" of the tires that I'm not sure about, and I was curious what the WP&Y used for tread width on all the tires. I know what the D&RGW used for tread width and blind tire width, but not the "back to back" dimention of either.

I could use a wheel center drawings from the IRCA: #111 #40 & #44 (I suspect none of those original drawings exist but they could be made) all from around the CRRM in CO. , but I'm not near there at the moment. If I'm going to travel to get info I would aldo need to WI (to Mid-West Loco...) if that #61 is acessible. Its the closest in design, was built the same year and thus would have been built to all the Baldwin rules for that same year. That might be the prototype to use for every part.

If the Baldwin drawings are of interest, CSRM and the De Gollyer library are your best sources. I'm not sure whether you want to know about how D&RG did it, Baldwin did it, WP&Y did it or IRCA did it.

dave

The Baldwin individual parts drawings for those locomotives do not exist at the CRRM or the DeGolyer or anywhere else in the USA, there might be some parts drawings of related locos in Guatemala, but not here.

I'm interested in how the tires were setup and their widths, on the Crystal River #101-#102 (later C-21 360 +361) as they were originally from Baldwin, so just answer that question for me.

I'll see if my Baldwin standards book includes 3 foot gage measurements.

dave