Hi,

If I had the money, I'd take a span and built new abutments to span a creek on my property. If you want a structural analysis of the bridge, you can determine the current member's states of deterioration and determine what a safe load is. (See my Civil Engineering for Outdoor Railroads Volume 2 for a basic idea of how to do this).

Many of the Mid-Atlantic and New England states have budget deficits. This may be a reason to not save the bridge. Saving every historic item is not a doable objective.

As a devil's advocate, what makes this bridge worth saving? Is it a unique civil engineering design? Is it where it might "earn" its keep?

In the late 1960s, the D&RGW was ready to abandon it's narrow gauge operations. After a lot of work by volunteers, it was determined that the 64 miles over Cumbres might be able to support itself. The rest from Chama west to Durango and south to Farmington was not deemed to be self sufficient. It was lost.

This interesting (to me) bridge needs to have a justification written for it. Either as a unique historic object or have a way to support itself (how about a 15" gauge park train ride over it).

Many (myself included at times) just want to save anything historic. The City of Atlanta is historic as a civil war battlefield. Should we tear down the city and restore it to the 1864 state? Should it be considered a historic area and restored to the Martin Luther King Jr era of the 1960s?

The same could be said for San Francisco (1904 earthquake) and New York City (the fairly recently (last 15-odd years) discovered slave remains.

So far I've not been able to grasp what makes this bridge stand out from other items that need saving. One reason for saving a section of the narrow gauge D&RGW is that it is an excellent example of the 1880-era civil engineering of a railroad trying to cross a mountain pass (as well as paying for much of its own way - not quite 100% there yet).

One last comment, why was the ex-NYC west side freight line elevated bridge saved? Think on it and maybe you can find a reason to place before the state of New York's government. They are not interested in railroads unless they can see earning votes for re-election.

Doug vV

Hi Doug,

That goes to the point I was trying to make about political geography. The High Line is right in Wall Street's backyard, whereas the Portageville Bridge is most definitely not.

To borrow a phrase from Orwell, some places in New York are more equal than others.

-Philip Marshall

That's so true about New York state. Southeast, the Dept. Of Translortation has to pay Tokyo prices to do anything, whereas north and west, they can pay Ohio prices. It's funny to watch Caltrans do highway projects outstate, they can't resist sticking that ostentatious city frill in there. Sometimes I think state DOT's should hire each other for certain jobs.

I actually had a college history professor (native Atlantan) who taught urban history (development of the modern US city). His opinion was that historically the best thing for Atlanta was the fact that it was torched in 1864 and rebuilt. In fact, he made a direct statement to the effect that it ought to be enshrined in law that every two or three decades, the city gets burned and rebuilt.

To be fair, a lot of historic properties did survive the war and factually, the city of Atlanta was mostly burned by the retreating Confederate forces.

Alan,

Your professor is/was a fool. There is a value to history and a cost to its replacement.

I'm not saying things shouldn't be upgraded but blanket statements like that are dumb.

My only criticism of saving sections of this bridge, if saving it in place it in place doesn't work, is that its component parts are less practical to reuse than other available historic bridges.

Regards,

Art S.

Hi,

I always liked the sentiment "If you do not learn history, you are doomed to relive it."

However Trying to save everything old is fighting change. In my opinion, Change is the human condition despite railing against it.

Controlling change and choosing what to save is always the issue. Some panic over "global warming" but there are epocs in geologic history showing Earth has been both hotter and colder.

When I started College in 1973, The best you could do was a pocket calculator (HP 35 for $395). No such thing as personal computers. NOW think about 1830, the opening of the first technological advancement that allowed mankind to travel faster than a animal - THE RAILROAD.

Determining what to save is always the issue and accepting the CHANGE is the human and natural condition is very basic. We die and our children develop new - change.

That's why I ask "what makes the Portage Bridge" worth saving.

Doug vV

Another Atlantan, Franklin Garratt, generally referred to any removal of anything old even if it was not particularly historic as Municipal Vandalism. Can't help but be sympathetic.

dave

http://www.nscorp.com/content/nscorp/en ... evill.html

Norfolk Southern and New York State begin replacement of key Portageville rail bridge in support of Southern Tier economy
Castile, N.Y. - Oct 28, 2015

Supporting jobs and the economy of New York’s Southern Tier, Norfolk Southern, the New York State Department of Transportation, and the New York State Office of Parks, Recreation and Historic Preservation, alongside numerous other supporters, broke ground today on a new $70 million steel arch railroad bridge in Letchworth State Park.

The new single-track bridge – expected to take about three years to construct – will be 900 feet long and located about 75 feet south of the current iron truss bridge, which spans the Genesee River Gorge. NS also will construct 1,200 feet of new track on either side of the gorge to align existing tracks with the new bridge.

“This successful public-private partnership underscores the strong confidence we all have in the ongoing potential of the Southern Tier,” said James A. Squires, Norfolk Southern chairman, president and CEO. “Norfolk Southern has a robust bridge program, and the new Portageville Bridge will be a testament to today’s expert engineers and the craftsmanship of today’s railroaders. We expect this project will start a new rail legacy for Letchworth State Park and the Southern Tier.”

When completed, the new bridge will be the linchpin of a vibrant Norfolk Southern rail line that helps businesses in Buffalo and the Southern Tier regions connect with markets east and west. Among the New York-based entities to benefit from the new bridge will be 10 short line railroads that serve local businesses and connect them to the Norfolk Southern network.

“This project is critical to the economy of the Southern Tier,” said New York State Sen. Patrick Gallivan. “The current bridge has served the region well for 140 years, but it must be replaced with a modern span that can meet the transportation needs of the 21st century. In addition to the construction jobs this project will create, the bridge will serve and support businesses throughout the region for years to come.”

The budget for the bridge project includes $3 million in design costs and $2.5 million in construction costs from the New York Department of Transportation; a $2 million grant from the Finger Lakes Regional Economic Development Council; and a $10 million grant from the U.S. Federal Highway Administration. Norfolk Southern will contribute the balance. Construction is expected to begin by the end of 2015.

“Maintaining a safe, modern freight rail network throughout New York State is critical to supporting business and generating economic activity,” said Matthew J. Driscoll, New York State Department of Transportation commissioner. “The new Portageville Bridge will be a beautiful and more efficient addition to Letchworth State Park and is one more example of Gov. Andrew Cuomo’s commitment to New York State’s rail network.”

“The Portageville Bridge project is a great example of building better infrastructure through partnerships between governments at the local, state, and federal level and the private sector,” said Michael Canavan, FHWA New York Division chief operating officer. “FHWA is proud to be a part of it. New York now has a bridge across the Genesee River that will move long distance freight more efficiently by rail while protecting the beautiful Letchworth State Park for the good of residents, neighbors, and visitors.”

The Erie Railroad built the current wrought-iron bridge in 1875, and while it has served several railroad owners from the Erie Lackawanna Railroad to Conrail, its current condition can no longer efficiently handle modern-day freight rail transportation. Currently, Norfolk Southern must slow freight trains crossing the bridge to 10 mph, and freight car weights must be reduced 13,000 pounds below the industry standard.

“Our customers look to Norfolk Southern for a 21st century transportation option that’s safe, reliable, and efficient,” said Jim Carter, Norfolk Southern chief engineer bridge and structures. “The way we meet this demand is to have a dependable infrastructure. We look to this new Portageville Bridge as a critical part of the Southern Tier’s success story.”

“The replacement Portageville Bridge will continue to complement the natural beauty of Letchworth State Park, while removing a longtime transportation bottleneck,” said Finger Lakes Regional Economic Development Council co-chairs, University of Rochester President Joel Seligman and Wegmans Food Markets CEO Danny Wegman. “Breaking ground on this project underscores the importance of private and state partners collaborating to accommodate the freight rail transportation that is so critical to our region’s economic viability. We are pleased that the Finger Lakes Regional Economic Development Council is supporting this major infrastructure project.”

The current bridge will remain open during construction of the new arch bridge and then be dismantled. During construction, the Portage entrance to Letchworth State Park will be closed to vehicular traffic. The nearby Castile entrance has been enhanced and will accommodate additional vehicular traffic. Additionally, the Mary Jemison, Finger Lakes and Gorge trails, and the Highbridge parking lot will be closed during construction.

State Parks Commissioner Rose Harvey said, “State Parks congratulates our partners at DOT and Norfolk Southern on the start of this important economic development project. The new bridge was thoughtfully designed to frame the view of the magnificent gorge for all who visit the nation’s favorite state park.”

Portageville may not be in NYC back yard. But the bridge is in the middle of the number 1 park in the country with more than a million visitors every year. that alone should be reason enough for NYS to keep it. Gary

If I had to prioritize rail preservation dollars in NYS, it would be hard for me to do anything else but focus on Buffalo Central Terminal and keeping the Adirondack line intact to Lake Placid for year-round service.

There are a lot of worthy projects, but some recent losses further cement those two as my top opportunities in NYS.

Just my opinion, of course.

Rob

The Portageville entrance and the road under the railroad bridge will close on December 17.

Dynamiting to start immediately for the new bridge.

Expected to reopen in 2018...

If the bridge truly is wrought iron, salvaging the wrought iron would keep blacksmiths supplied with that rare metal for the next 100 years.

As you can imagine, there's a LOT of confusion and misinformation being spread about about bridges supposedly being made of cast or wrought iron, mainly stemming from the fact that 1) a lot of bridges used combinations of the materials in various parts, and 2) there was a Wrought Iron Bridge Co. based in Canton, Ohio that built both wrought iron and steel bridges.

The best information I can find, from Bridgehunter.com and HAER records, indicates that the bridge's current truss and girder spans are steel, installed to replace the original wrought iron in 1903-04, but that the trestle upright bent sections are still wrought iron. Supposedly the replacement steel was 260 tons. I would suggest that this would be the only combination using wrought iron that would have let the railroad(s) get away with not replacing this bridge for so long.

http://www.thedailynewsonline.com/apps/ ... 999&Ref=AR

Portageville Bridge project chugs along

By JOE LEATHERSICH
JLEATHERSICH@BATAVIANEWS.COM
PUBLISHED: WEDNESDAY, APRIL 6, 2016 AT 12:30 AM

The project broke ground on Oct. 15, 2015, but regular construction didn’t begin until December.

Although it’s in the early stages, the project is operating smoothly so far, according to Carmen M. Garozzo, Business Segment Leader at Bergmann Associates.

The project is a significant undertaking, Garozzo said, and comes with a $58 million price tag — a “very good price for a project of that magnitude,” Garozzo added.

Gorazzo says the New York State Department of Transportation plans to launch a site later this month that will post project updates with text posts, photos and live cams.

The project is scheduled to finish in December of 2018.

The Portageville entrance re-opened today after being closed for almost 3 years.

Up close views are now possible of NS's Genesee Arch Bridge.

The weather was crappy. Here are some pics I took:

http://photos.greatrails.net/show/?orde ... =thebigham