When A Political Storm Arrives At Your RR

Alexander D. Mitchell IV · **Posted:** Thu Aug 27, 2015 10:25 am

OR, "Is YOUR Railroad Politically Correct?"

NOTE:
I am NOT seeking commentary on the merits or lack thereof of the incident being reported in this story, or any discussion on political issues, "political correctness," etc. in general. If I want that, I can just turn to "social justice warrior" web forums and right-wing talk radio. Nor do we need commentary on the news media and their chosen (consciously or subconsciously) reporting styles and story selection processes.

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-m ... story.html

Quote:

Group of black women kicked off Napa wine train after laughing too loud

In three days, this article has garnered 650+ comments, and some rather unflattering attention by both right-wing and left-wing pundit/"agitprop" commentary sites.

Now, the Napa Valley Wine Train, by its very nature, no doubt confronts this type of situation on a more or less routine basis. So does Amtrak. I'd hate to have to try and put someone off a train on the Verde Canyon RR, Cass, or Cumbres & Toltec, though.

But in this day of social media, someone can readily scream "Racism!" or "Sexism!" or whatever and garner woefully disproportionate attention, and as we well know "a lie can travel around the world before the truth has a chance to put its pants on."

Those of us with crew training may well want to consider exploring such issues as a training exercise. I have personally witnessed, in the large city park near me, large ethnic gatherings--"historically African-American fraternity" reunions, massive Latino family reunions, Caribbean festivals, etc.--butt heads with police after growing too boisterous or not closing down at the appointed times, and it's plain to see how a simple civility issue can get trumped up into (false) accusations of bigotry.

Is there any "REST of the story" we're not hearing here?

IronTie · **Joined:** Tue Aug 14, 2012 1:12 pm **Posts:** 27

If you are going to serve alcohol on your trains, it is inevitable that you will occasionally have people who become drunk and/or disorderly and you best have an established written protocol for dealing with them, with an escalating series of steps culminating with ejection. That way the railroad can state they treat everyone the same and no one can claim they have been treated differently on the basis of race, gender, etc.

Im sure there is more to the story and I would expect the on board staff would have kindly asked those ladies to keep it down before resorting to ejection. That being said, it was a bit disconcerting to see the railroad falling over itself apologizing afterwards, which in this day and age tends to only fan the flames.

Scranton Yard · **Joined:** Thu Feb 27, 2014 10:08 am **Posts:** 733

Alexander D. Mitchell IV wrote:

... as we well know "a lie can travel around the world before the truth has a chance to put its pants on."...

Maybe the truth should consider streaking.

QJdriver · **Posted:** Thu Aug 27, 2015 11:11 am

In Guatemala we had plenty of drunks riding with us, but the only person who ever gave us so much shit that we threatened to put them off the train was sober. It was night time in the jungle, and they suddenly got a lot more polite. Too bad that doesn't seem to work here in the good old US of A.

psa188 · **Posted:** Thu Aug 27, 2015 11:54 am

I agree with Milo Yiannopoulos that this is about class, not race. See his article:
http://www.breitbart.com/big-government ... book-club/

The Napa valley is region that caters to elitist wine snobs. I suspect that the behavior by the book club would not be considered out of line at most restaurants but it really pushed someone over the edge. The wine train admits fault in this one, according to CNN: "The Napa Valley Wine Train was 100% wrong in its handling of this issue," CEO Anthony Giaccio said in a statement. "We accept full responsibility for our failures and for the chain of events that led to this regrettable treatment of our guests."

http://www.cnn.com/2015/08/25/us/napa-w ... lack-feat/

This is a public-relations disaster for the Wine Train.

Alan Walker · **Posted:** Thu Aug 27, 2015 12:11 pm

Alexander D. Mitchell IV wrote:

OR, "Is YOUR Railroad Politically Correct?"

Those of us with crew training may well want to consider exploring such issues as a training exercise. I have personally witnessed, in the large city park near me, large ethnic gatherings--"historically African-American fraternity" reunions, massive Latino family reunions, Caribbean festivals, etc.--butt heads with police after growing too boisterous or not closing down at the appointed times, and it's plain to see how a simple civility issue can get trumped up into (false) accusations of bigotry.

When I was working as a conductor at TVRM, each trainman was given a policy manual that addressed everything from schedules to emergency incidents. It covered dealing with disruptive passengers and media. On occasion, we did training exercises and hold discussions on various subjects. When I was supervising the trainmen, there were some issues that presented themselves that were not covered by the operating rules or other policies, as many tourist roads model their rules on freight railroads and most of those stripped the passenger rules from their books. So what we did was research and apply relevant passenger service rules from the old Southern Railway and Amtrak passenger rules.

Chris Webster · **Joined:** Sat Aug 25, 2007 12:45 am **Posts:** 1087

Alexander D. Mitchell IV wrote:

Is there any "REST of the story" we're not hearing here?

Yes, there is:
BusinessWire: Napa Valley Wine Train CEO Apologies to African American Book Club Members Removed from Train for Noise Complaints (August 25, 2015)

Quote:

[Wine train chief executive officer Anthony “Tony” Giaccio] wrote an apology letter to the club saying: “I want to apologize for your experience on the Napa Valley Wine Train on Saturday, Aug. 22. We accept full responsibility for our failures and the entire chain of unfortunate events you experienced.”

The letter to the group continued:

“Clearly, we knew in advance when we booked your party that you would be loud, fun-loving and boisterous—because you told us during the booking process that you wanted a place where your Club could enjoy each other’s company. Somehow that vital information never made it to the appropriate channels and we failed to seat your group where you could enjoy yourself properly and alert our train’s staff that they should expect a particularly vibrant group.

“We were insensitive when we asked you to depart our train by marching you down the aisle past all the other passengers. While that was the safest route for disembarking, it showed a lack of sensitivity on our part that I did not fully conceive of until you explained the humiliation of the experience and how it impacted you and your fellow Book Club members.

“We also erred by placing an inaccurate post on our Facebook site that was not reflective of what actually occurred. In the haste to respond to criticism and news inquires, we made a bad situation worse by rushing to answer questions on social media. We quickly removed the inaccurate post, but the harm was done by our erroneous post.

“In summary, we were acutely insensitive to you and the members of the Book Club. Please accept my apologies for our many mistakes and failures. We pride ourselves on our hospitality and our desire to please our guests on the Napa Valley Wine Train. In this instance, we failed in every measure of the meaning of good service, respect and hospitality.

“I appreciate your recommendation that our staff, which I believe to be among the best, could use additional cultural diversity and sensitivity training. I pledge to make sure that occurs and I plan to participate myself.

“As I offered in my conversation with you today, please accept my personal apologies for your experience and the experience of the Book Club members. I would like to invite you and other members to return plus 39 other guests (you can fill an entire car of 50) as my personal guests in a reserved car where you can enjoy yourselves as loudly as you desire.

“I want to conclude again by offering my apologies for your terrible experience.”

Atkinson_Railroad · **Posted:** Thu Aug 27, 2015 2:00 pm

Actually surprised the story didn't make an entry onto this forum earlier in the week, considering it being tied to/with railroading.

"...Is there any "REST of the story" we're not hearing here?"

My first thought in reading about the ruckus, was that there remains, and will always remain a portion of society whom will forever not know about, nor understand ethic culture, or behaviors of peoples other than their own.

Not one bit ashamed in mentioning a stereotypical statement.
American blacks (African Americans) are passionate, LOUD, soulful human beings who love shouting, and yelling above the next one in what they're communicating. It was witnessed and learned about while in the United States Marine Corps in the 1970s.
(The service is filled with cultural lessons.)

Yes the women were loud, aggressive, fun loving people clashing with the vexatious spirit of the other train riders. It wasn't a political storm.
It was merely a situation where those aboard the train didn't have the patience, tact, or a set of ear plugs required to endure.

The article mentions it's not the first time problematic parties have rode on the railroad.
The train's Facebook page initial response was,
"... “Many groups come on board and celebrate. When those celebrations impact our guests, we do intervene.”
And the story goes on to say the above statement was later deleted.

The railroad operation is on the hook for this one. They've not learned how to coordinate larger groups.
They seem to be learning about it now. As train chief executive officer Anthony “Tony” Giaccio wrote in his apology letter to the group of women.

Designate a Banquet Car... as bars, and restaurants have for decades... in devoting adjoining rooms for such gatherings.

Problem solved. Now let's PARTY!

John

(a Welsh/English American ; )

http://www.pbase.com/visual_first/image/148983065

railfan261 · **Joined:** Fri Apr 27, 2012 6:30 pm **Posts:** 226

The brutal truth is that people can--and often do--get hyper while drinking alcohol regardless of their race, creed, etc. If the book club people were disturbing other passengers by being too noisy, the train crew had a right to ask them to tone it down. But since the book club members got asked to leave, well that makes the train crew "racist" by default? God forbid that people should take responsibility for their actions regardless of their race, creed, etc.

If you ask me, the Napa Valley Wine Train is obviously caving in to politically correct pressure due to the allegations they are "racist." I also think museums should not serve any booze at special events, even beer, because when you mix people and alcohol, you are bound to have some trouble sooner rather than later.

I also note that the Yelp! crowd is savaging the train in their reviews, in which some Yelp! members claim to have suffered discrimination on the train too. The Napa Valley folks really are in for a PR mudstorm here.

p51 · **Posted:** Thu Aug 27, 2015 3:03 pm

railfan261 wrote:

The brutal truth is that people can--and often do--get hyper while drinking alcohol regardless of their race, creed, etc. If the book club people were disturbing other passengers by being too noisy, the train crew had a right to ask them to tone it down. But since the book club members got asked to leave, well that makes the train crew "racist" by default?

I don't know what world you live in, but yeah, it sure does.
Is that fair? Not in the least.
But you'd have to be blind not to recognize that when you're dealing with folks of a different race, anything you do that they don't like, will be considered racist by someone. Anyone in service industry will tell you stories of being called racist to either get them in trouble or get a manager to step up and get what was being demanded (owed or not).

railfan261 · **Joined:** Fri Apr 27, 2012 6:30 pm **Posts:** 226

p51 wrote:

railfan261 wrote:

The brutal truth is that people can--and often do--get hyper while drinking alcohol regardless of their race, creed, etc. If the book club people were disturbing other passengers by being too noisy, the train crew had a right to ask them to tone it down. But since the book club members got asked to leave, well that makes the train crew "racist" by default?

I don't know what world you live in, but yeah, it sure does.

Okay, where did that come from?! What I was trying to say is that it is too easy these days to jump to conclusions about racism unless there is concrete evidence. Where is the concrete evidence for this incident?

p51 wrote:

Is that fair? Not in the least.
But you'd have to be blind not to recognize that when you're dealing with folks of a different race, anything you do that they don't like, will be considered racist by someone. Anyone in service industry will tell you stories of being called racist to either get them in trouble or get a manager to step up and get what was being demanded (owed or not).

I see your point here, but still I ask, when does accusations of racism become an excuse for not taking responsibility?

p51 · **Posted:** Thu Aug 27, 2015 6:13 pm

I have a feeling this thread is heading to lock mode soon due to the topic, but still...

railfan261 wrote:

When does accusations of racism become an excuse for not taking responsibility?

It's been that way as long as I can remember, and I grew up in the Deep south and I'm in my 40s. I worked at a copy place while I was going to college in North Florida. Some local African-American churches had people come in on Sunday mornings to have the inserts for their church bulletins made. For a long time, it was me and another white guy. We were both was accused of being racist so often by the women (they were always women for some reason) doing these bulletins, that the copy place had to put someone of their race onto the shift with me. Our boss didn't take these complaints very seriously because they knew I wasn't like that (and most of all, these women weren't spending much money anyway). But plenty of times, we had to have one of the other African-American employees back us up when we were accused of being racist when we couldn't do something they wanted or wouldn't give a discount they weren't entitled to (they often wanted deep discounts because it was for a church, which meant nothing to my employer).
I couldn't count the number of times one of my co-workers would get up in the face of one of them, very upset that the 'race card' was being played like that. Their words, not mine.

Alexander D. Mitchell IV · **Posted:** Thu Aug 27, 2015 7:03 pm

As I'm reading this, the railroad originally said that the party was put off the train because their initial requests to the group were met with both verbal and physical abuse.

The railroad has now done a complete public capitulation, throwing itself prostate before the throne of public opinion.

This indicates, to my mind anyway, that one of two things actually happened:
1) the crew (falsely) claimed that the passenger group became combative, and evidence surfaced (such as cell phone video) disproving or not proving such a situation;
2) the passengers were abusive, but no evidence exists or is being provided to support this, and the power of commercial damage by (false) claims of racist action is potentially far greater than the promotion of the truth.

Those "battling" the larger agendas of self-appointed "social justice warriors" would say--as many have been for some time--"THIS is what's wrong with America today!"

We as rail preservationists aren't supposed to be in this fight. The question is, what can/should we do when this "fight" is--seemingly inevitably--dragged in front of us.

p51 · **Posted:** Thu Aug 27, 2015 7:29 pm

Alexander D. Mitchell IV wrote:

This indicates, to my mind anyway, that one of two things actually happened:
1) the crew (falsely) claimed that the passenger group became combative, and evidence surfaced (such as cell phone video) disproving or not proving such a situation;
2) the passengers were abusive, but no evidence exists or is being provided to support this, and the power of commercial damage by (false) claims of racist action is potentially far greater than the promotion of the truth.

Fair enough.
And in either case, commercially, you're a fool for not begging forgiveness.
And in the potentiality of a third scenario where the crew reacted correctly to the behavior that merited it, an apology is probably merited then, too, sadly.

Alexander D. Mitchell IV · **Posted:** Thu Aug 27, 2015 7:48 pm

Boy.

In that case, I think I'll go get drunk and boisterous on an Amtrak train, so I can get put off in Podunksville, then have Amtrak apologize and then invite me and five of my friends to ride free on their behalf.