Virtually all of the so-called "reviews" being posted on Yelp! in response to the Napa Valley train incident are quite vicious, with pointed comments like "Napa Valley White Train" or "All aboard the KKK train!" being posted. I've just realized that if this happened on a heritage railroad or museum operation whose life blood is paying passengers, such an incident might be a kiss of death to their operations--or would it? That is a question worth pondering here, people.

Nobody should be surprised at those reviews.
We've gone from one extreme, where people 'of color' are viewed in a horrific suspect eye (as in, one would get beaten up, thrown out, or hung from a tree and people would often say, "Well, he must have had it coming", to the opposite where stuff like this can happen, and whether what the RR did was deserved or not, far too many people think it must be a 'racist' move without knowing (or caring) what the reality was.
You could call it backlash for countless years of injustice, but either of the two ways something like this was/is treated are each equally crazy and reactionary.

Well said, Lee.

We can all hope no heritage railroad or railroad museum ever has to cope with such a controversy.

I've been giving this some thought, and comparing it to my attending last nights performance of MOTOWN THE MUSICAL in Charlotte, NC which had a wonderfully more diverse audience than usual for top tier shows in the season. Of course, the subject matter led to a lot more audience response than customarily seen, but less than at geezer rock concerts such as the Crosby Stills and Nash tour a couple years ago. The response in both cases was loud and happy and shared by people of all backgrounds, and - here's what i think is the difference - appropriate given the context.

This is why we have Chuckie Cheese and McCormack and Schmidt, but not in the same building at the same time. Kids can't be expected to behave appropriately at a top end steakhouse, but they can be kids at Chuckie's with impunity - and adult customers don't go the Chuckie's expecting soft classical music, silver flatware, and a quiet decorum that won't interrupt the enjoyment of their meal.

The wine train is more McCormack and Schmidt, less a loud bar. perhaps there was a miscommunication about the nature of the party that booked, and expected behavior in that context - if so it should be made clear before the booking is taken.

It seems racist to me to believe that adult people of any specific heritage shouldn't be expected to know common courtesy about what behavior is appropriate in a public setting, unlike the expectation that young children would not know - it's part of being a responsible adult and living in society. I've known people from many backgrounds I would enjoy being with in formal and informal occasions, and others I'd avoid everywhere - groups of overpriviliged white southern frat boys is a great example of "to be avoided" for example, which doesn't mean that not in a pack they can't be individually civilized..... If you want a venue for a loud tipsy bunch , book a place that suits that - and if your place isn't, make it clear when you talk to the inquirer.

And, it is California after all. I think the situation would have been different in New Jersey.

In spite of temptation to wax editorial, I'm just going to leave these follow-up articles/essays here:

Apology not accepted:
http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-m ... story.html

A Latina woman "figures out" that she, too, was "discriminated against" in April:
http://www.sfgate.com/news/article/Seco ... 467230.php

An African-American-centric website declares "Jim Crow" is back:
http://www.theroot.com/articles/culture ... _ride.html

I'm going back to beer, dammit.

So are all heritage railroads and museums going to have to offer cultural sensitivity training after this incident, or just dinner trains?

This could happen to anyone, anywhere. And court of public opinion simply won't care what really happened.
Whereas we used to default in a situation like that that the group must have been acting up due to their ethnicity, we've now defaulted to the train staff must be racist for doing anything to the group... due to their ethnicity.
Like I wrote earlier, neither default is fair.

I can't say that I recall any similar issue when I was working at TVRM. Our policy was that group sales always passed on group bookings to the operating department and the conductor got a printout of the manifest so that they could block seating on board and make arrangements for a suitable train consist. Standard policy was to avoid putting general ticketed passengers and groups in the same car-particularly school groups. If it meant adding an additional car, we'd do that and turn the locomotive by itself on the wye.


Frankly, I consider this to be a tempest in a teapot compared to the other things we could be focusing on as a nation.

Do you expect any less? These days, nobody is responsible for their own actions.

I'm not sure if this is relevant here or not, but the Rigi Bahnen in Switzerland will now be running separate trains for Chinese groups in response to complaints from other passengers about rude behavior. Predictably, Chinese media are now accusing them of racism:

New York Daily News: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/swiss-rail-service-offer-special-trains-rude-chinese-article-1.2341443

Blick [in German]: http://www.blick.ch/news/schweiz/zentralschweiz/knatsch-mit-schweizer-gaesten-chinesen-alarm-auf-der-rigi-id4095846.html

-Philip Marshall

To get back to the railroad history part. Many railroad historians (and members of this site) seem to have missed all the rich black history railroads offered, some of the very early civil rights movements were started by Pullman Porters who demanded better treatment. And what about folk hero's like John Henery, or Sim Webb Casey Johns fireman.

Let me see if I understand this. If you want to run a quiet, orderly, wine-tasting train, you may no longer do so because to enforce order might be culturally insensitive at best and racist at worst? Nice.

Fixed that for you.................

I suppose some of this can be related to the expectations of people in the "audience" compared to those "performers in the show." San Diego's Union Tribune had an article this morning in the "Arts & Culture" section about audience behavior in live theater. People singing along with performers, texting through the show, and even one guy trying to charge his phone from an on-stage (fake) electric outlet. A point was made that a live theater show is not a rock concert. The latter guy's excuse was, "I didn't realize that the stage is considered off-limits." Full article is at : http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/new ... etiquette/

Perhaps dinner trains or just museum rides in general should post a few behavior expectations. Our museum (Pacific Southwest RR Museum) has a few "rules" on our web site, such as no smoking and no alcohol, plus the statement, "The Museum provides family oriented entertainment and education. Visitor behavior not consistent with a family environment will not be tolerated and may result in refusal of service at the Museum’s discretion." We rarely need to enforce this policy, but it is a policy that is in existence.

In my 25 years of volunteering there, the worst behaved group I've had was a group of 20 or so white female school teachers. The best group was 2 bus-loads of primarily Hispanic school kids, supervised by only 3 or 4 adults. It is totally impossible to pre-judge behavior based on race, ethnicity, perceived economic status (clothes, car they arrived in) etc.

Well the Yelp! storm seems to have died down, thus proving that this so-called "incident" was nothing but a tempest in a teapot. This means that if a museum or tourist railroad experiences something similar, controversy will burn for a few days and then subside with no lasting impact on operations or reputation.

That being said, is it wise for the Minnesota Transportation Museum to be hosting an event where beer is being served? What is the alcohol content of the beer being served?

http://transportationmuseum.org/roundhouse-on-tap

I know serving beer at historical group meetings seems to be all the rage up here in Minnesota, but if you ask me, groups like MTM are asking for trouble by mixing booze with their events.