C&O 377

Alexander D. Mitchell IV · **Posted:** Wed Mar 09, 2016 7:26 pm

Mgoldman wrote:

Not sure why this engine is part of the B&O Railroad Museum collection, like the Clinchfield engine, the CNJ Camelback or the other C&O engines, though assume some were just fortunate (for the Museum) acquisitions (like the CNJ engine(s)) and others, like the GG1 and above mentioned, simply represent the the future timeline of the B&O from Chessie through to the CSX umbrella.

Suffice it to say that the entire B&O, C&O, Western Maryland, Reading, CNJ, Pere Marquette, etc. ownership relationship, even before Chessie System, looked like the stereotype incestuous hillbilly bloodline. If someone wants to start a C&O Railroad Museum with a lot of space under cover, and then try to relieve the B&O Museum of everything from the 377 to the 1604, good luck.

J3a-614 · **Posted:** Wed Mar 09, 2016 9:18 pm

Mgoldman wrote:

Second question - the Museum's web site states this about #377:

"... the city of Logan, West Virginia issued a request to the C&O asking for the use of a vintage C&O train which might have resembled the one that arrived in 1904 with the completion of the Logan Branch. The C&O agreed to age the No. 377 by installing an oil headlight, flanged stack, cylinder head stars, wooden pilot and old style paint scheme."

http://www.borail.org/CO-No-377.aspx

How much of that "aging" remains today? Does anyone have a link or pics of the engine as she actually ran in service? Seems the pilot? is wood, though the cowl? is metal. The fanged stack seems to have been left?, wonder if the original survived? The stars on the cylinder heads remain, as does the old style paint scheme, though I didn't get a good look at the headlight to determine if it's the "aged" oil lamp.

/Mitch

Actually, the "aging" basically consisted of that flanged stack, a box style headlight, and the paint job. Otherwise she looked very much the same, along with sister 378, late in the steam era (photos courtesy of Chesapeake & Ohio Historical Society).

http://www.cohs.org/repository/archives ... s-3095.jpg

http://www.cohs.org/repository/archives ... s-4522.jpg

http://www.cohs.org/repository/archives ... s-2047.jpg

In her "aged" form at Huntington, W.Va. in 1952:

http://www.cohs.org/repository/archives ... s-4860.jpg

Mgoldman · **Posted:** Wed Mar 09, 2016 9:52 pm

J3a-614 wrote:

Mgoldman wrote:

Second question - the Museum's web site states this about #377:

"... the city of Logan, West Virginia issued a request to the C&O asking for the use of a vintage C&O train which might have resembled the one that arrived in 1904 with the completion of the Logan Branch. The C&O agreed to age the No. 377 by installing an oil headlight, flanged stack, cylinder head stars, wooden pilot and old style paint scheme."

/Mitch

Actually, the "aging" basically consisted of that flanged stack, a box style headlight, and the paint job.

Nice! Thanks for sharing those!

Seems the flanged stack is gone (preserved anywhere?)
The older style oil headlamp remains - I think we can all say we would like to see the original headlamp and number boards returned - if they still exist?
The stars and paint scheme are easily rectified but remain.

Have not made out a photo distinguishing the old from new style pilot? They appear identical? Or am I missing something?

/Mitch

J3a-614 · **Posted:** Thu Mar 10, 2016 4:14 am

Mgoldman wrote:

Nice! Thanks for sharing those!

Seems the flanged stack is gone (preserved anywhere?)
The older style oil headlamp remains - I think we can all say we would like to see the original headlamp and number boards returned - if they still exist?
The stars and paint scheme are easily rectified but remain.

Have not made out a photo distinguishing the old from new style pilot? They appear identical? Or am I missing something?

/Mitch

Glad you're enjoying the photos!

The engine does seem to have had an extended wooden pilot as part of its "aging," it's visible in this shot at Cincinnati in the 1960s:

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=386662

Apparently it was either added or removed as needed for exhibits, or may have simply been replaced by the in-service pilot later; there are photos of the engine with both styles in Phil Schuster's "C&O Power," published by the late Al Staufer around 1964-1965. In that book, Staufer (who wrote the photo captions) mentioned that the extended wooden pilot had been replaced by the original one for ease of towing the locomotive dead in freight trains.

The "flanged" stack, at least to me, looks like the in-service stack with some phony rings added; I'm glad they're gone.

The headlight is either gone, or perhaps enclosed in the box. I think it's a fairly common (or used to be common) Pyle job; it's replacement shouldn't be something that would be too difficult (at least I would hope so!)

Another photo or two, and other discussion, of the 377 in exhibition service in this older thread; alas, some of the links are now "dead:"

http://rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=33710

Another recent view inside the car shop, by Mr. Goldman (small world!):

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.p ... 875&nseq=9

J3a-614 · **Posted:** Thu Mar 10, 2016 4:24 am

Looking for other vintage photos of the 377:

http://mds.marshall.edu/rail/3/

Reportedly an exhibition photo at Huntington, W.Va. in 1959; it definitely looks like the rings were added to the in-service stack:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8423/7688 ... 61f6_b.jpg

Source:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/21448724@N05/7688495226

Photo supposedly from 1977 at Baltimore; the engine has the extended pilot in this one, and the stack rings are gone.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/phillytrains/8542253303

Color shot at Baltimore; this looks like it might have been a postcard image:

http://www.subwaydreams.com/My-Site-Pag ... ayx725.jpg

Source:

http://www.subwaydreams.com/My-Site-Pag ... n-page.htm

Another very similar shot from Railroad.net:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2405/211 ... 9e.jpg?v=0

From the Toledo, Lake Erie & Western photo archives:

http://tlew.org/files/2814/3951/6257/CO_377.jpg

Source:

http://tlew.org/photo-archives/

The 377 and the wooden combine, apparently on a barge in what's supposed to be Baltimore; the extended wooden pilot is quite visible here. It almost looks like something that would be bolted over the in-service pilot.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1532/246 ... 267809.jpg

Source (with a lot of other interesting pix of other engines):

http://www.flickriver.com/groups/266440 ... teresting/

In HO scale:

http://www.brasstrains.com/Classic/Prod ... 377-CUSTOM

It's interesting to contemplate that this locomotive, as old as it is, has spent more of its life as an "exhibition" engine than it did in service.

Les Beckman · **Joined:** Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm **Posts:** 6482

J3a-614 wrote:

It's interesting to contemplate that this locomotive, as old as it is, has spent more of its life as an "exhibition" engine than it did in service.

J3a-614:

When you think about it, that could probably be said for almost every steam locomotive that survives today.

Les

PaulWWoodring · **Posted:** Thu Mar 10, 2016 5:13 pm

As to how long 337 was in Toledo, I rode behind it on the TLE&W in the Summer of 1971. So it was there at least that long. The story I remember being told (mind you I was 13 or 14 at the time) about why their use of it ended was that it was taken away from the TLE&W for not being properly maintained and cared for. I remember hearing (have no idea if this is true or not) that it developed frame damage of some kind while in use by them.