Toledo Terminal Maumee River Bridge to be Razed

Trainlawyer · **Posted:** Fri Jun 24, 2016 10:06 am

http://www.toledoblade.com/local/2016/06/20/114-year-old-former-railroad-span-to-be-demolished.html

Quote:

While designed to be able to open for tall-masted vessels, the ODOT report noted that no such openings are known to have occurred, and no evidence exists of any motors or controls on the structure.

Having driven by this bridge many times over the years, the most recent being early this year, I have no reason to quarrel with the analysis of its condition. I do question the comment in the ODOT report quoted above since if the span is properly balanced and the bearings are maintained, then two labourers with a large crank should have been adequate.

GME

sbhunterca · **Joined:** Sun Aug 22, 2004 7:58 am **Posts:** 728

So CSX was paid $6,572,000 from federal funds, so they could avoid the liability of demolishing this decrepit bridge?

Somebody, find out who made the sales pitch and hire him! The tourist railway industry always needs good salesmen!

Regarding the crank, that is most likely exactly how the bridge was turned. No doubt, when it no longer needed to be turned regularly, the crank was removed and locked in a safe place... and modern engineers assumed that an electric motor or hydraulics, and associated controls, were missing. After all, people don't do physical labour anymore.

:-)

Steve Hunter

wesp · **Posted:** Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:08 pm

The bridge is probably an "armstrong" bridge like the one still used across the canal in Lewes, Delaware.

https://video.search.yahoo.com/yhs/search;_ylt=A0LEVr3ZhG1Xu4oAu8knnIlQ;_ylu=X3oDMTE0N21zY3NvBGNvbG8DYmYxBHBvcwMxBHZ0aWQDUFJEQ1RMMV8xBHNlYwNzYw--?p=Lewes+Railroad+Bridge+Opening&fr=yhs-mozilla-002&hspart=mozilla&hsimp=yhs-002#id=1&vid=05a7bbb28fe4cf276c9a1069f418aa85&action=view

Wesley

joe6167 · **Posted:** Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:32 pm

Makes you wonder if the cost of all these trails is really worth it...

Dave · **Posted:** Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:27 pm

Randy G knows a lot more about how magic can be used to project ideas about "worth it" or not....... and has done many studies that were not magical and reached more grounded conclusions, but given crystal balls and studies are neither one guarantees, the only perfect measurement is build it and offer it and see how much it pays.

What we can do with some degree of accuracy is, if we can find the hidden metrics, look at other trail and tourist rail projects that were built and operated and see how each did. then it is easy to compare apples and lugnuts. Or is it?

Lincoln Penn · **Joined:** Wed Feb 02, 2011 9:40 pm **Posts:** 841

Same principal as an armstrong turntable.

There are more than a few railroad swing and lift bridges around the country that
were built because the Corps of Engineers demanded it. It is amazing how many of them were operated once (usually to test them after they were completed) and were never again ever opened or lifted.

Alexander D. Mitchell IV · **Posted:** Fri Jun 24, 2016 8:17 pm

Lincoln Penn wrote:

Same principal as an armstrong turntable.

Sure.
Now tell me where the employees stand to push on the beams sticking out on the ends. >;-D

I cannot comment on the specifics of the Maumee River Bridge because I don't know the specifics, but if (and I repeat IF) it's actually like the Lewes drawbridge...... well, let me just steal the info I posted for the BridgeHunter listing:

Quote:

The bridge is operated manually by a capstan inserted in a drive shaft located in the deck. The capstan and drive shaft turn beveled open reduction gears that engage the pinion gear mounted on the pivot pier. The bridge rotates on its center bearing with eight balance wheels traveling on a track. A shaft operates a worm gear that moves two end wedges at the abutment end of the swing span’s longer arm. In the closed position, the wedges lift the arm to afford a rigid support on the abutment and neutralize the end deflection of the arms. As with all movable railroad bridges, an important consideration is aligning the rails on the bridge with those of the approaching railroad tracks. To accomplish a secure fit, the rails on the ends of the bridge are bowed upwards by rail lift rods. After the bridge is closed, the operator engages a lever that lowers the rods, thus lowering the rails into a slotted fitting with the approach tracks.

Here's a video of the process:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GrspAPjQZmk

Not it occurs to me that the Maumee River Bridge is one HECKUVA BIG bridge span to move manually. But what do I know, I've only been casually studying bridge engineering for 40 or so years......

Lincoln Penn · **Joined:** Wed Feb 02, 2011 9:40 pm **Posts:** 841

Alexander D. Mitchell IV wrote:

Lincoln Penn wrote:

Same principal as an armstrong turntable.

Sure.
Now tell me where the employees stand to push on the beams sticking out on the ends. >;-D

I cannot comment on the specifics of the Maumee River Bridge because I don't know the specifics, but if (and I repeat IF) it's actually like the Lewes drawbridge...... well, let me just steal the info I posted for the BridgeHunter listing:

Quote:

The bridge is operated manually by a capstan inserted in a drive shaft located in the deck. The capstan and drive shaft turn beveled open reduction gears that engage the pinion gear mounted on the pivot pier. The bridge rotates on its center bearing with eight balance wheels traveling on a track. A shaft operates a worm gear that moves two end wedges at the abutment end of the swing span’s longer arm. In the closed position, the wedges lift the arm to afford a rigid support on the abutment and neutralize the end deflection of the arms. As with all movable railroad bridges, an important consideration is aligning the rails on the bridge with those of the approaching railroad tracks. To accomplish a secure fit, the rails on the ends of the bridge are bowed upwards by rail lift rods. After the bridge is closed, the operator engages a lever that lowers the rods, thus lowering the rails into a slotted fitting with the approach tracks.

Here's a video of the process:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GrspAPjQZmk

Not it occurs to me that the Maumee River Bridge is one HECKUVA BIG bridge span to move manually. But what do I know, I've only been casually studying bridge engineering for 40 or so years......

Then you realize I was referring to the load and the bridge being perfectly balanced, so comparatively little effort, either at the ends of the turntable or the ring rail on the bridge, is necessary to move it. e.g. it does not require a jillion horsepower motor to do the job.

Dougvv · **Joined:** Sat Aug 21, 2004 10:52 pm **Posts:** 914

Hi,

Quote:

the only perfect measurement is build it and offer it and see how much it pays.

Good point.

Just be sure the operator is competent.

I.E. The CRI&P (The Rock) folded about 1980. Almost all of its mainlines and branches were purchased by others and operated successfully.

I.E. Penn Central. Pennsylvania Railroad was considered the IBM or Microsoft in the late 1880s and in the early-mid 1940s. Poor management pushed t hid the issues by mergering with the New York Central. Crash and burn.

Doug vV

jimnorthwood · **Joined:** Sat Jun 25, 2016 8:55 am **Posts:** 1

As this bridge is about ten minutes from where I live, it has always been an interesting subject. There does not seem to be consensus on whether any mechanism, be it electrical or mechanical, was actually ever installed to open the bridge. By the time the bridge was built commercial shipping traffic on this upper stretch of the Maumee River had pretty much ceased. An N&W train (trackage rights; likely grain) derailed on the bridge in I believe 1982 or 1983. Whatever the year, the bridge was never used again after that incident.