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 Post subject: Re: Indiana Transportation Museum news
PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 11:55 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm
Posts: 6468
Kevin and John -

Thanks for the comments about Orton. I seem to recall that HVRM contacted them about our Purdue crane and received a nice reply. That's been a while back, and I'll see if I can talk to the guy involved to see if my memory isn't playing tricks on me.

As for Orton itself, in the Morning Sun Book on the Minneapolis & St. Louis Railway, I found out that the "Louie" ordered a 160 ton from Orton in 1956 that doubled as a pile driver! I had never heard of such a combination, and I wondered if others of this type were built by Orton, or other companies? The book shows M&StL #X-11 cleaning up a wreck, so I guess the design was successful.

Les


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 Post subject: Re: Indiana Transportation Museum news
PostPosted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 10:23 am 

Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2014 5:05 pm
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We seeem to have hijacked this thread with Orton talk. Let's move it over to a new Orton Crane thread.


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 Post subject: Re: Indiana Transportation Museum news
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 1:05 pm 

Joined: Fri Sep 20, 2013 2:34 pm
Posts: 192
http://www.indystar.com/story/news/2017/03/13/fair-train-supporters-ready-rumble/99023640/

As always, the comments are priceless.


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 Post subject: Re: Indiana Transportation Museum news
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 2:00 pm 

Joined: Thu Oct 08, 2015 11:54 am
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Location: New Franklin, OH
Uhhhh..... Am I missing something? $5M to repair 37 miles of track vs, $9M to tear out 9 miles and make a trail?

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 Post subject: Re: Indiana Transportation Museum news
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 2:41 pm 

Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 4:03 pm
Posts: 940
Yes, the 5 million figure is very inflated and purposefully so.

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 Post subject: Re: Indiana Transportation Museum news
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 3:16 pm 

Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2005 9:06 pm
Posts: 2563
Location: Thomaston & White Plains
Figure 1000 ties per mile to replace (that's about 1/3 of the ties per mile), at $100/per tie, all in (spikes, labor, disposal of old tie, cost of new 6x8 tie). That's about $3.7 million. Add in some ballast and surfacing, and you're not far off $5 million.

Now, I certainly don't know the condition of the line now, but almost any older secondary or branchline could easily take 1/3 tie replacement.


Howard P.

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 Post subject: Re: Indiana Transportation Museum news
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 3:29 pm 

Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 4:03 pm
Posts: 940
And if you stack items in like reconnecting to NS or CSX in the report...

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 Post subject: Re: Indiana Transportation Museum news
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 3:37 pm 

Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 10:49 am
Posts: 770
Any way you slice it, somebody is trying to kill them off. It costs less to rehab the railroad than it would to rip it all out to put in a trail....politicians....


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 Post subject: Re: Indiana Transportation Museum news
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 4:13 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 12:15 am
Posts: 585
Did anyone else notice the comment on the corridor size?, I wonder where they got the 120 feet number from. You only need about 40 feet.
---10 foot wide corridor for the rail
---5' wide safety corridor on either side of the track
---2'-5' for chain link fence or partition wall
---10 foot wide drive-able walking path (emergency & maintenance)
---5'-7' allowance for grading

Quote:
The city did some preliminary research on putting the trail next to the tracks and found it could be dangerous or impractical. Generally, the corridor needs to be about 120 feet wide. The Nickel Plate is narrower than that in most places


Is this a multi-track corridor they are talking about? Even at a generous 15' center to center spacing that would be 6 tracks plus trail. (13' is standard below 50 mph spacing)

Rich C.


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 Post subject: Re: Indiana Transportation Museum news
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 4:49 pm 

Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 5:10 pm
Posts: 1182
Many railway rights of way are 66 feet wide.


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 Post subject: Re: Indiana Transportation Museum news
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 6:21 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 12:15 am
Posts: 585
Even if that is the case in this area, they don't need another 50 feet for a trail RoW. If the RoW in question is 66' then the railroad probably has/had the extra width slated for access road and second track expansion (if & when needed).
Rich C.


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 Post subject: Re: Indiana Transportation Museum news
PostPosted: Tue Mar 14, 2017 6:07 pm 

Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 10:17 am
Posts: 249
Location: New York
nathansixchime wrote:
Yes, the 5 million figure is very inflated and purposefully so.


>this is my shocked face<

-otto-

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 Post subject: Re: Indiana Transportation Museum news
PostPosted: Tue Mar 14, 2017 7:11 pm 

Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2011 12:07 pm
Posts: 1199
Location: Leicester, MA.
Otto Vondrak wrote:
nathansixchime wrote:
Yes, the 5 million figure is very inflated and purposefully so.


>this is my shocked face<

-otto-

I can do you one better Otto...
Image

In all seriousness though, we were hearing rumors about supposed "mismanagement" from a while ago and an ongoing safety audit of some kind that has operations on hold for the time being, and now a trail proposal? Maybe I'm a bit paranoid, but doesn't that seem a bit convenient?

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 Post subject: Re: Indiana Transportation Museum news
PostPosted: Sat Jun 17, 2017 8:33 pm 

Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 8:18 pm
Posts: 2226
just came down the wire...

Quote:
Train museum plans federal suit alleging government interference
Posted by: "Dennis Parejko" railchicago@sbcglobal.net railchicago@sbcglobal.net
Date: Fri Jun 16, 2017 2:43 pm ((PDT))

Train museum plans federal suit alleging government interference
Indianapolis Business Journal

The Indiana Transportation Museum has notified officials from Hamilton County, Noblesville and Fishers that its intends to file a federal lawsuit accusing the government of unjustly interfering in the museum's operations, causing it a critical loss of more than a half-million dollars in revenue.The Noblesville-based not-for-profit museum said it filed the tort-claim notice Friday afternoon. The notification was sent to the leaders of the Hoosier Heritage Port Authority, the mayors and deputy mayors of Noblesville and Fishers, all three Hamilton County commissioners and several other county officials. It also was sent to Gov. Eric Holcomb and Attorney General Curtis Hill.“We have tried to find ways to work with these entities and our efforts have not been successful," John McNichols, the museum’s board chairman, said Friday afternoon at a press conference. "Our efforts have been met with indifference and opposition.”The museum and area officials have been wrestling over the futureof the 37-mile railroad for months. Noblesville and Fishers seek to convert a section of the rail corridor into a 14-foot-wide pedestrian trail, but the museum wants the rails to remain so it continue to operate trains on them.The Hoosier Heritage Port Authority, the quasi-government entity that oversees the railroad, terminated its policy-of-use agreement with the museum in March 2016, citing concerns about the museum's financial condition, maintenance and safety conditions of the tracks.The port authority ultimately forced the museum to discontinue its popular State Fair Train and Polar Bear Express rides last year.The tort-claim notice, which museum officials made public Friday afternoon, said the museum lost more than $350,000 in revenue because it couldn't operate the Polar Bear Express. It also says it lost another $150,000 when it was prohibited from operating the Indiana State Fair Train.The museum said it has agreements to operate the excursions with Fishers, Noblesville and Hamilton County, which together own the Nickel Plate Railroad. The notice says the museum was “current on all terms and conditions” of the operating agreement with the port authority at the time it was prevented from using the tracks.The museum's notice said the actions by the government officials denied its rights under the Fourteenth Amendment and the Fifth Amendment.Local officials defamed the museum, interfered with an established business, breached an agreement, failed to engage in fair dealing, failed to comply with the Indiana Open Meetings and Records Act, and engaged in abuse of process, according to the notice.Attorney Samuel Bolinger is representing the museum.Officials from Fishers and Noblesville declined to comment. Rhonda Klopfenstein, president of the Port Authority, did not respond to IBJ’s request for comment.The notice for the tort claim was sent to Noblesville Mayor John Ditslear and Deputy Mayor Steve Cooke; Fishers Mayor Scott Fadness and Deputy Mayor Leah McGrath; Hamilton County Commissioners Steve Dillinger, Mark Heirbrandt and Christine Altman; Hamilton County Tourism Inc. President and CEO Brenda Myers; and Madison Railroad CEO and port authority consultant Cathy Hale.The port authority recently issued a request for proposals for a new operator of the track, and responses were due Tuesday. Four groups submitted responses—the transportation museum, the Indianapolis Metropolitan Railway Co. of Indianapolis, Hoosier Heritage Railroad Inc. of Fishers and Nickel Plate Heritage Railroad of Arcadia.The museum contends it won’t be given a fair chance. A media advisory issued Friday morning by the museum said the lawsuit it intends to file will focus on the “biased RFP process.”McNichols said he hoped the parties involved could come to an equitable agreement before the Indiana State Fair begins Aug. 4. The authority has said it will not make a decision in time for an operator to offer the fair train this year.


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