N&W 2156 and its "cracked frame"

John D · **Joined:** Mon Aug 23, 2004 2:28 pm **Posts:** 485

Hi folks,

As I follow the commentary on 2156's return, I occasionally see references 2156 having a "cracked frame". I've tried Google searches, and I'm sure nothing about this would be on snopes.com...just looking for facts.

Is, in fact, 2156's frame "cracked"? If so, to what extent? If this were true, and an issue, I can't see NS moving it across half the continent.

Thanks in advance.

co614 · **Posted:** Sun Jun 14, 2020 8:22 pm

You've answered your own question. Obviously NS wouldn't touch moving it on its own wheels if it had any mechanical or structural issues. You can be sure that the NS mechanical pros went all over it and gave it a clean bill of health prior to the current move from Roanoke to St. Louis.

Ross Rowland

Termite7 · **Joined:** Thu Aug 21, 2008 8:29 pm **Posts:** 397

error

Termite7 · **Joined:** Thu Aug 21, 2008 8:29 pm **Posts:** 397

Over the years I have heard many stories about cracks that were discovered during restorations. I recently heard that the 630 had a cracked or broken frame that had been repaired with a thermite weld. She runs nearly every weekend and has not fallen apart or anything...so do we worry too much about frame cracks?
T7

mjanssen · **Posted:** Sun Jun 14, 2020 9:49 pm

Photo by me - the file says 12/2015

Tails · **Joined:** Fri Mar 29, 2013 11:14 pm **Posts:** 139

Really not as bad as people make it out to be. Could be easily repaired if someone wanted to throw some money into it.

eze240 · **Joined:** Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:29 am **Posts:** 319

A lot depends on the crack, it's location, etc....
If the repair was done right, it should be stronger than the original material...
Typically, you don't just weld down the length of the crack....as it will just crack thru again...you have to do things like stop drill it to relieve at least some of the stresses, prep it to allow proper/ maximum weld penetration, etc.... It may also require adding doubler plates,etc...
frame cracks and repairs of such are pretty common in steam locomotives.... But on a big locomotive they can be considered too expensive, difficult, etc ...

joe6167 · **Posted:** Sun Jun 14, 2020 11:49 pm

You would be amazed at how the railways could piece a locomotive back together when they want to. Crawl around just about any locomotive's frame and you find some VERY impressive (and massive) weld repairs.

Les Beckman · **Joined:** Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm **Posts:** 6482

So, a question. Was 2156 saved BECAUSE of her cracked frame? "Those people in St. Louis have asked for a Y yet again; let's give them that engine that's got a cracked frame."

Les

Kelly Anderson · **Joined:** Tue Sep 14, 2004 7:52 am **Posts:** 2477

John D · **Joined:** Mon Aug 23, 2004 2:28 pm **Posts:** 485

Thanks to everyone for the feedback. That does appear to settle the question: yes, there is a crack, but NS's inspection of the crack didn't preclude 2156's movement to/from Roanoke.

Follow-on question, but disclaimer first: no, it's not going to get restored to operation (no reason, no money, no place to run, etc). No dispute there.

But if it were to operate again-does operating the locomotive place more stress on this frame crack, vs. the stresses incurred in hauling it dead-in-tow?

nedsn3 · **Posted:** Mon Jun 15, 2020 9:11 am

Kelly Anderson wrote:

From an old time boiler maker who worked on engines of all three lines, " Pennsy built superior engines and maintained them in average condition. Western Maryland bought average engines and maintained them in perfect condition. N&W built perfect engines and didn't maintain them at all."

Now that's a good one Kelly! Ned

C&O1309 · **Joined:** Sun Aug 21, 2011 6:17 pm **Posts:** 9

The "crack" occurred at MOT, it's caused by freeze damage. The cavity behind it is full of lead. Water got in between the lead and the frame, over time it caused the crack to grow. When I first saw the locomotive in the 80's the crack was about 2 inches long. Had it not been for the added lead, it never would have occurred. Water is a powerfull thing.

If the engine were to be made operational the damage would have to be repaired. The lead would have to be melted out and standard procedures for repairs to a cast steel frame would have to be followed. Not a big deal, just takes a little time and hopefully a cool day. The damage is not an issue for towing the locomotive around in essetially light engine moves. Different story if tonnage trains were coupled to the pilot.

While we are on cracks on 2156, there was tales told of a cracked side rod. There was not a cracked side rod, there was a side rod that was torch cut in two at MOT. I forget the year but the engine was getting moved and someone did not put the wrist pin in all of the way and while moving the locomotive the side rod was bent when it struck the back of the wrist pin. Everything was wedged in so the rod was cut to expedite it's removal. It was then welded back together later. That damage was temporarily repaired prior to movement to Roanoke. If the locomotive were to be made operational that rod would need to be replaced.

Both repairs would be minor compared to all of the work it would take to get it operational. N&W shopped freight engines every two years. 2156 recieved a a new firebox and all of the other improvements to make it an "improved Y6" in 1957, it was retired in 1959. Two years was up, it was due for the shop and the machinery is worn out. Combine that with the years it sat outside at MOT, the engine needs a lot of work to make it operational.