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 Post subject: Questions on Nantucket
PostPosted: Thu Jan 06, 2022 12:08 am 

Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2011 12:07 pm
Posts: 1202
Location: Leicester, MA.
So digging into my old notes, I came across some that I took when I read Cape Cod Railroads by Robert Farson back when I was in my first year of college.

The first bit of note came on Page 136, where it was noted that the remains of the motor car Siasconset were buried near the old car barn after a collision with the 0-4-4 #2 in 1913. There's another point on Page 132, a caption under the picture of #1 (the former Profile and Franconia Notch Hinkley 4-4-0 that made its way to the island by way of the BRB&L). The caption claims the engine, boarded up cab, had been left on the Washington Street siding after an accident that led to the engine's retirement and replacement by the 0-4-4. The end of the caption says that it wasn't far from the junction of Fayette and Washington Streets where it was later buried in sand. And from what I gather from the end of the chapter on Nantucket, the 0-4-4, coach and combine that were left in service at the time were what went to France for use with the AEF in Bordeaux.

I can't find mention that this 4-4-0 was actually scrapped, and judging by the stuff with the motor car I can't help but wonder if they just dug a pit and rolled the engine into it. They already did it with one busted piece of equipment. And from the description of the location, there's a parking lot on top of part of the area. The area that seems to have been where some of the railroad's locomotive and rolling stock "facilities" were located.

I guess what I'm trying to get at is there any documentation that anyone is aware of that suggests that this engine was actually scrapped? Because I've managed to track down some local lore suggesting that there is an engine buried under Washington street near the town hall annex, which coincides with the location giving in the Farson book. I've so far got a total absence of information here that I just can't establish the truth. It could just be a local rumor that made it into the historical record that has no basis, or there could be something to it. I honestly don't know. It's not like narrow gauge engines in remote areas haven't been abandoned or tossed to the side before. And I don't know how much more remote you can get than an island twenty six miles from the nearest dock on the mainland at a time where removing railroad equipment from that island would involve a lot of manual labor for a locomotive that otherwise would've cost more to send back to the mainland for scrap than you could get back on the scrap sale...

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 Post subject: Re: Questions on Nantucket
PostPosted: Thu Jan 06, 2022 4:23 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 5:55 pm
Posts: 1109
Location: Warren, PA
Good lord, another actual railroad stuck out on a Cape Cod island?

When I was out to Martha's Vinyard I saw the history on that one, basically a railroad on the beach that didn't survive the storms or bankers for very long and closed by 1896.

This one made it longer at least..... and invites a session of ground-penetrating radar.

So many of these vintage railroad projects and their funding remind me of the rampant speculation today in digital currency, NFT's, you name it.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions on Nantucket
PostPosted: Thu Jan 06, 2022 4:41 pm 

Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2011 12:07 pm
Posts: 1202
Location: Leicester, MA.
Randy Gustafson wrote:
Good lord, another actual railroad stuck out on a Cape Cod island?

When I was out to Martha's Vinyard I saw the history on that one, basically a railroad on the beach that didn't survive the storms or bankers for very long and closed by 1896.

This one made it longer at least..... and invites a session of ground-penetrating radar.

So many of these vintage railroad projects and their funding remind me of the rampant speculation today in digital currency, NFT's, you name it.


So then assuming that taking some radar sleds to Nantucket is worth the effort, two things.
1) Does anyone on here know anyone who works with GPR?
2) Does anyone know any of the local leadership?

I'm all for giving it a go and seeing if something is there, but let's be honest. If some bearded dude shows up and starts doing radar sweeps, I'm pretty sure that might ruffle feathers...

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 Post subject: Re: Questions on Nantucket
PostPosted: Thu Jan 06, 2022 4:50 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 7:19 am
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Location: southeastern USA
Not if you wear a tinfoil hat. People will stay far away.

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 Post subject: Re: Questions on Nantucket
PostPosted: Thu Jan 06, 2022 5:38 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 5:55 pm
Posts: 1109
Location: Warren, PA
That's probably closer to reality than what you think.

Years ago in one of the modeling magazines, a story was related of a modeler that was collecting dried Goldenrod blossoms from alongside the highway for scenery use. He was questioned on just exactly what he was doing.

Apparently he launched into some kind of biological survey nonsense that eventually bored the inquisitor away. But the line is worth repeating....

"They still think I'm an idiot, but just a government idiot, and that can be easily accepted".

But the good part about GPR in the right situations is it's nondestructive, certainly preferable over the predecessor, the backhoe.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions on Nantucket
PostPosted: Thu Jan 06, 2022 7:03 pm 

Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 12:53 pm
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Location: Alna, ME
There once was a train on Nantucket,
With tracks three feet wide; who'd of thunk it.
But a hurricane came
and blew off the train.
And now to move freight they must truck it.

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 Post subject: Re: Questions on Nantucket
PostPosted: Thu Jan 06, 2022 7:07 pm 

Joined: Thu Oct 08, 2015 11:54 am
Posts: 2055
Location: New Franklin, OH
Randy Gustafson wrote:
But the good part about GPR in the right situations is it's nondestructive, certainly preferable over the predecessor, the backhoe.

But a backhoe is SO much more fun. If you’re gonna do something weird in front of strangers, go big.

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 Post subject: Re: Questions on Nantucket
PostPosted: Thu Jan 06, 2022 9:28 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 8:31 am
Posts: 1341
Location: South Carolina
elecuyer wrote:
There once was a train on Nantucket,
With tracks three feet wide; who'd of thunk it.
But a hurricane came
and blew off the train.
And now to move freight they must truck it.


You, sir, won the Internet today!

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 Post subject: Re: Questions on Nantucket
PostPosted: Thu Jan 06, 2022 9:33 pm 

Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2011 12:07 pm
Posts: 1202
Location: Leicester, MA.
jayrod wrote:
Randy Gustafson wrote:
But the good part about GPR in the right situations is it's nondestructive, certainly preferable over the predecessor, the backhoe.

But a backhoe is SO much more fun. If you’re gonna do something weird in front of strangers, go big.


Well if there is something there, you can at least use the GPR to mark off the safe boundaries so you can use the fun stuff to dig it out... But that assumes that what is available for information is fact.

At the same time where that engine would be could present challenges. If it's under that parking lot? Probably less disruption. If it's under or right next to either Washington Street or Fayette Street, sure you could locate it. But then actually excavating and extricating it becomes far more disruptive. And what happens if you dig down and the condition of the locomotive is so abysmal that frankly recovering it is just going to lead to it's destruction? Granted there's been horrible cases of degradation recovered and preserved, but a century in the ground not far from salt water? Honestly I think it's a coin flip on what shape it would be in.

And then there's the final question. Where do you preserve it? I'd imagine the locals would want to keep a piece of their history where there's so little remaining of that specific part, but would there be the interest and capabilities of say, the Nantucket Historical Association, to preserve it? Where they're not even half a mile down the street from our potential gravesite, they'd be the logical place to go first, but do they even have the room? Getting it off the island these days is going to be easier thanks to the car ferries, but you'd probably have to charter one to get the engine to the mainland if it goes there. I'd imagine that a locomotive isn't going to give them much room for other stuff to take back to Hyannis, and I doubt that a ferry trip for one locomotive and tender, plus the people riding back with it, is going to be a cheap thing at all.

So many questions... All of which center on somehow confirming the presence of the 4-4-0. There has to be more documentation somewhere that could help shed more light on this.

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 Post subject: Re: Questions on Nantucket
PostPosted: Thu Jan 06, 2022 10:24 pm 

Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 3:07 pm
Posts: 1209
Location: B'more Maryland
Fun fact: the railroad is responsible for the existence of The Club Car, an island restaurant.

https://www.theclubcar.com/

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