It is currently Fri May 09, 2025 12:59 am

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 21 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Existing HVYWT Pullman Sunroom cars?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2022 8:42 pm 

Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 12:56 am
Posts: 492
Location: Northern California
Western Pacific 653 is parlor / sunroom heavyweight with a short open platform. It is at the Western Railway Museum at Rio Vista Junction, CA. WP leased the car from Pullman until about 1940s, at which time it was purchased by WP.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/rspict ... ?id=746670


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Existing HVYWT Pullman Sunroom cars?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2022 11:29 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 8:28 am
Posts: 2727
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
I read Roger’s original question, Howard’s clarifying question, and Rogers’s reply the wrong way. I assumed the “yes” was for both species of car. Of the two, far fewer solariums seem to exist, than the rebuilt open platform brethren.

Three of the solariums that do exist are Alabama, Kentucky, and Tennessee. They exist in heavily rebuilt form as modernized mid train lounge cars used by the L&N.



Jack Powell wrote:
"Kentucky Railway Museum has the 10 section Solarium Observation Car Mt. Broderick
Midwest Railway Preservation Society in Cleveland has Mt. Baxter of the same design.
Old Dominion Chapter NRHS has Pullman Dinwiddie County
Rail Giants Museum has NKP business car number 6, the former Carleton Club
Sister car Kitchi Gami Club is privately owned.
Heber Valley has a solarium car of Canadian extraction. I'm not sure if it's of CP or CNR heritage."

Not to call out Mr. Wilkins in particular, but most if not all of the cars he mentions are simply enclosed (as opposed to open) observation-lounge cars, with various sleeping accommodations. A solarium or sunroom car is characterized by the high windows (with transom sash) mentioned in Howard's post, and shown in Timothy's photos. Other typical "spotting features" of a solarium are the absence of a rear-end diaphragm (at least as-built), a short brass-railed gate across the end opening, and a pair of narrow double end doors that could be opened to create something of the feel of an open platform for travelers in the short solarium area, which was typically furnished with wicker chairs and separated by a bulkhead from the main lounge. "Sun-parlors", sunrooms, or solariums, similarly furnished, were trendy features of nicer homes of the 1920s, and Pullman appears to have simply been following that fashion.

There were also open-platform observation cars with high (non-transom) windows throughout the observation lounge, such as the NYC-assigned "Valley" series cars used on the 20th Century Limited. Some were later rebuilt with vestibules having deep windows in the end sheets and special deep-windowed vestibule doors, while retaining their former observation platform windows, all amounting to a see-through vestibule and some of the appearance a solarium car, but without any actual solarium seating area.

_________________
David M. Wilkins

"They love him, gentlemen, and they respect him, not only for himself, for his character, for his integrity and judgment and iron will, but they love him most of all for the enemies he has made."


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Existing HVYWT Pullman Sunroom cars?
PostPosted: Sat Feb 19, 2022 3:41 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 8:51 pm
Posts: 2055
Location: Southern California
More about a car previously mentioned.

Western Pacific lounge car 653 at Western Railway Museum (Bay Area Electric Railroad Association) has a sun room. The rear end platform is barely deep enough for a person to stand on.

From the webpage about the car
Quote:
This car was built by the Pullman Company, lot 4101, as their car “Holton”. It was built as a 16-section sleeping car, plan 2412A, and was released for service in February 1913. The “Holton” was part of a 20 car series and was built for train “San Francisco Overland Limited”. In May 1931 the Pullman Company rebuilt the car into a buffet lounge car with sunroom; plan 4006B, for the Western Pacific Railroad as their number 653. The WP leased the car from Pullman for five years. In September 1936 the Western Pacific purchased the car from The Pullman Company for $38,629.97. It was used on the train “Exposition Flyer”. The car was part of a three car series, 651-653.

Also at the Museum is a Pullman 8-section-buffet lounge car with end windows, but not a sunroom. This is the Pullman car CIRCUMNAVIGATERS CLUB. This is its history from the webpage about the car:
Quote:
The car was built by Pullman Standard for the Pullman Company, lot 4528, as their car “Brady”. The car was part of a thirty car series “Balfour to Buttrick”. It was built as a 16-section sleeping car, plan 2412F, and was released for service on December 19, 1917. It was built with type LN air brakes and one 18-inch brake cylinder. The Pullman Company rebuilt the car into an eight section, buffet, observation car, plan 4025. It was released to service in this configuration on October 28, 1932 as car “Circumnagavigators Club”. The car was intended for service between St. Louis and Minneapolis-St. Paul on trains operated by jointly by the Wabash and Minneapolis and St. Louis Railroads. The rebuild included changing the air brakes to type UC. Ice air conditioning was added to the car on April 26, 1934. The interior plan was changed to 4025N on July 8, 1943. The significance of this change is not known. The color of the exterior of the car was changed from Pullman color (dark green) to two tone gray on August 30, 1954. The Pullman Company retired the car from service and sold it on October 1, 1965.

_________________
Brian Norden


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Existing HVYWT Pullman Sunroom cars?
PostPosted: Sat Feb 19, 2022 4:03 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 8:51 pm
Posts: 2055
Location: Southern California
If I recall correctly, NKP #6 at RailGiants display at the Los Angeles County Fairgrounds in Pomona, Calif., does not have a sunroom. It has regular height windows with end windows. It was Pullman "Carleton Club" an 8 section-buffet-lounge car.

_________________
Brian Norden


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Existing HVYWT Pullman Sunroom cars?
PostPosted: Sat Feb 19, 2022 8:37 am 

Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 8:21 pm
Posts: 534
Location: Danbury, CT
Don’t know the plan number but the following solarium obs is in the RMNE collection.

Pullman Standard 10 section Solarium/Obs Car #201. Originally- “Malatha”, then “Mount Royal”. Pullman to KCS 1948. Served until the arrival of the four former NYC BUDD tavern-obs. cars. Now owned by Railroad Museum of New England. Stored, stabilized, and awaiting restoration in Thomaston, CT.

_________________
Randy Patterson
RMNE/NAUG


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Existing HVYWT Pullman Sunroom cars?
PostPosted: Sat Feb 19, 2022 11:49 am 

Joined: Sun Jul 15, 2018 8:42 pm
Posts: 27
ACL nee Pullman "Washington Club" is at SRM in Duluth, GA. It is an 8 Section, Buffet Lounge with Solarium windows and is largely unchanged with original Pullman fixtures. The car is currently stored and off display awaiting exterior and interior refresh. Here's a photo of it in excursion service after being donated to the Atlanta Chapter NRHS.

http://abpr.railfan.net/abprphoto.cgi?a ... onClub.jpg


Offline
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 21 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


 Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 122 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: