DSNGRR buying diesel locomotives

PMC · **Joined:** Sat Oct 17, 2015 5:55 pm **Posts:** 2876

70000 wrote:

dieselloco wrote:

This company built a narrow gauge locomotive for like the isle of mann railway someplace like that, forget which one, and the locomotive never ran! And that was before DSNG placed the order. Just sorry to see this type of thing happening to anybody

A rather sorry tale the Isle of Man one. This (from Wikipedia, but accurate as far as I am aware) states it did work, for a while, but hasn't for some time.....
Built as a replacement for No. 17 Viking it is the first new locomotive to join the fleet since No. 18 Ailsa. The locomotive's underframe, bodywork, engine, generator and controls are brand new. The bogies are modified from a GE industrial locomotive. It is the first locomotive on the Isle of Man Railway to feature a cab at each end, arriving on the Isle of Man in December 2013. Early tests revealed a problem with overheating, and a new prime mover was supplied by the manufacturers under warranty. Further testing saw the locomotive perform several passenger duties, notably at the head of the railway's dining train. It has however, seen very limited service since. It finally entered regular service in August 2019. This, however, only lasted a couple of weeks before a "Power problem" caused it to become stranded in sidings at Castletown. This was its most recent spell in revenue service. Technical issues are understood to included slipped tyres on the wheels, software problems, oil leaks, transmission seizures and traction motor flashovers.

Here it is in 2015, MP&ES must have had terrific salespeople, because their product has generally been described as "poorly executed".
Here it is moving, something we likely will never see the D&SNG units do: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xmoeYn80Xyc

marshall5 · **Joined:** Wed Feb 05, 2014 6:30 am **Posts:** 56

No.21 (known as "The Cabbage") is currently stored unserviceable in the running shed at Douglas with the traction motors off Island for repair. The Wiki list of defects omitted mentioning the cracked truck frames which had to be replaced with new ones cut from thick plate. It was purchased from MPE because a reconditioned loco appeared to be a better deal to our Government bean-counters but the repair costs, so far, have cost the IMR as much again - perhaps not such a bargain after all.....
Ray.

PMC · **Joined:** Sat Oct 17, 2015 5:55 pm **Posts:** 2876

marshall5 wrote:

No.21 (known as "The Cabbage") is currently stored unserviceable in the running shed at Douglas with the traction motors off Island for repair. The Wiki list of defects omitted mentioning the cracked truck frames which had to be replaced with new ones cut from thick plate. It was purchased from MPE because a reconditioned loco appeared to be a better deal to our Government bean-counters but the repair costs, so far, have cost the IMR as much again - perhaps not such a bargain after all.....
Ray.

I am surprised the traction motors are giving problems, if they are GE 764's they would be the one thing on the locomotive I would have confidence in, whenever someone mentions "locomotive" and "Caterpillar truck engine" together I would slowly back away.

I am really embarrassed as an American that some of our shysters took advantage of the Isle of Man operation.

marshall5 · **Joined:** Wed Feb 05, 2014 6:30 am **Posts:** 56

PMC wrote:

I am surprised the traction motors are giving problems, if they are GE 764's they would be the one thing on the locomotive I would have confidence in, whenever someone mentions "locomotive" and "Caterpillar truck engine" together I would slowly back away.

I am really embarrassed as an American that some of our shysters took advantage of the Isle of Man operation.

Please don't be embarrassed as we have our fair share of shysters here too.
I volunteer with the guy who is directly involved in trying to sort out No.21's problems and will ask him for further details re the motors on Sunday.
Regards,
Ray.

dieselloco · **Joined:** Thu Oct 03, 2019 2:31 pm **Posts:** 73

Marshal5 please let us know more about the problems encountered with this locomotive. It's been there for just shy of a decade. A locomotive really just has three things to do, forward, backward, and stop. I've worked on some pretty crappie loco's. And it can usually sorted out pretty quickly. If it's like, fly by wire all bets are off!! Analog to do the basic stuff is the best. Give me a GP-7 any day, not enough horsepower to hurt anything! But it has oh my! manual transition!!

marshall5 · **Joined:** Wed Feb 05, 2014 6:30 am **Posts:** 56

dieselloco wrote:

Marshal5 please let us know more about the problems encountered with this locomotive. It's been there for just shy of a decade. A locomotive really just has three things to do, forward, backward, and stop. I've worked on some pretty crappie loco's. And it can usually sorted out pretty quickly. If it's like, fly by wire all bets are off!! Analog to do the basic stuff is the best. Give me a GP-7 any day, not enough horsepower to hurt anything! But it has oh my! manual transition!!

Pretty much as listed in the Wiki quote at the top of the page, overheating, loose tyres, cracked truck frames, gearbox & motor failures, oil leaks and, of course, software problems. All in all a poor design poorly executed. The big question is when does one stop throwing good money after bad?
Ray.

PMC · **Joined:** Sat Oct 17, 2015 5:55 pm **Posts:** 2876

marshall5 wrote:

dieselloco wrote:

Marshal5 please let us know more about the problems encountered with this locomotive. It's been there for just shy of a decade. A locomotive really just has three things to do, forward, backward, and stop. I've worked on some pretty crappie loco's. And it can usually sorted out pretty quickly. If it's like, fly by wire all bets are off!! Analog to do the basic stuff is the best. Give me a GP-7 any day, not enough horsepower to hurt anything! But it has oh my! manual transition!!

Pretty much as listed in the Wiki quote at the top of the page, overheating, loose tyres, cracked truck frames, gearbox & motor failures, oil leaks and, of course, software problems. All in all a poor design poorly executed. The big question is when does one stop throwing good money after bad?
Ray.

When the unit actually did operate, were you happy with its performance? That is, aside from the mechanical problems did it, as dieselloco put it, go forward, backward, and stop effectively? I guess that will determine if it is worth putting even more money into.

I would watch what D&SNG does, they apparently have around $3m sunk in their two units already even when they halted payments and I'll bet they are looking into usable trucks, pending disposition from the bankruptcy court. Pictured below is one of the two trucks for one of them that the railroad has apparently rejected (photo from 12bridge on the narrow gauge forum).