Yes, yes, that's how we did it in the 70s. Today? Not a chance.

I think it's kinda funny how some would embellish on the definition of "mainline steam". Simply put, it's steam on the main line. Neither word denotes a minimum or maximum speed unless you want to throw in some qualifiers or adjectives. :>)

[Crawls under kitchen table so as not to be pelted by hurled objects]

In theory, dragging a dead steamer on its wheels from one place to another fits that definition.

Whose "mainline"? The Union Pacific's, or the San Luis Southern's? Norfolk Southern's, or the Stewartstown's? Technically, narrow-gauge steam on the EBT, C&TS, or D&S is "mainline steam."

But one has to concede there's a big difference between an East Broad Top experience, a Grand Canyon Railway experience, a Reading & Northern experience, and the UP trips of old with UP 844 or 3985, or even the various outings with NKP 765, SP 4449, etc. (such as SP 4449 hitting close to 80 on a couple of its 1976 SR outings......).

And remember, there can be no diesels in the consist....

Yes, absolutely no diesel(s) in the consist. If you're going to run steam...run steam.

Ross Rowland

Class 3 track is 60 mph for passenger and class 4 is 80 for passenger trains. Plus block signals if you want to go faster than 59 mph.

Well, this has morphed a bit..... but if the goal is to recreate what the majority of operation on mainline railways in the steam age, you'd be hauling freight with a 2-8-0 or 2-8-2 (depending on era). Yeah, I'd love to ride along in the caboose or cab, but not a marketable or sustainable option for most people. If we agree to provide a more sustainable and romantic experience, that opens things up a bit more. Now, how to we revert to the rule book and SOP's of the era we want to recreate?

Don't forget each trip being 16 hours and waiting in the hole somewhere in the middle of nowhere in 3' of snow because the timetable says you've gotta wait for that opposing second class train that got a knuckle.

Or are we only looking to recreate the good days?

Apples and oranges. UP already runs out there with steam, hell the steam shop IS there... but the 611 is not based anywhere on the BB.

Way off topic, But I had recollections of MAS for 2102 on the original blue mountain and reading as 60mph. I'm pretty sure the speedometer on one of of the old MU's showed we were going 55, through Shoemakersville.

Not apples and oranges... its Big Boys and J's haha. I think you missed my point entirely though - crowds will flock to the Big Boy, the J, the Daylight, etc. when they are running someplace new and the runs are rare. That doesn't mean VMT has tapped into an unchartered market.

Hi All
The New River train trips out of Huntington, WV to Hilton, WV,, with NKP # 765 and Milwaukee Road # 261...
I have rode behind both locomotives on the above trips, and the speed of the both locomotives was restricted to 50 mph,,because of the age of the locomotives.
NKP 765 or the Milwaukee Road 261,, could easily run at the current track speed with the New River Train,, with 30 coaches with no problem,, until they got into the New River sub division with all its twists and turns..
But because of the age of the locomotives, CSX,, did restrict the locomotives by 10 mph,, to run at 50 mph,, instead of 60 mph,,which was the track speed,, during the trips my friend and I rode, in 1988, 1991, and the last New River Train to run behind Steam in 1994.. Pat.

765 did 70MPH on the Joliet Trips and I'm pretty sure the last 261 mainline trip we hit 60.

765 and 261 were not restricted because of age... they can run with the best of them! haha.

Yeah, I don't recall any age related speed restrictions on the New River Trains. I'm pretty sure 765 did achieve 60mph on some of those runs. 30+ cars on a twisting railroad with long grades with wet leaves and frost thrown into the mix was very impressive even if full track speed couldn't be hit.

I've never equated a "mainline excursion" with high speed. Would you rather ride an excursion on tangent, level track at 79mph or would you rather a tough pull on steep mountain grade with a locomotive down on it's knees to hit 10mph? I'll take the latter any day. I've ridden a lot of mainline excursions over the years and many of my favorite experiences never topped 40mph.

I think where we may have gotten a little sidetracked is our possibly mixing up our definitions.

To me the term " Full Monty" is a much better way to describe what to me is the full mainline steam product ( no diesel(s), minimum 60mph track speed, open window coach availability, multiple speed runbys, cab ride raffle tickets, reliable scheduling, reasonable ticket prices), that to me is the ideal steam excursion package.

Will we ever again see it offered.?? I think yes and perhaps sooner than you think.

Keep the faith, Ross Rowland