I certainly have known or heard of more than a few American railfans who have visited Cuba in the last 20 years. Some averted U.S. policy by going through Mexico or Canada or joining foreign rail tour groups. Others actually got official U.S. sanction to travel there--rare or not.
Has Trains Unlimited Tours ever gone there?
I don't want to really start a political debate on U.S. policy but it does not seem any more unpatriotic than visiting the former "Evil Empire" and its satellites before they cracked open.
I wish I had the time, money, and opportunity to go there. Actually, the Hershey electric stuff fascinates me more than the steam.

> I certainly have known or heard of more than
> a few American railfans who have visited
> Cuba in the last 20 years. Some averted U.S.
> policy by going through Mexico or Canada or
> joining foreign rail tour groups. Others
> actually got official U.S. sanction to
> travel there--rare or not.
> Has Trains Unlimited Tours ever gone there?

*Several times until recently. In all probability they "lead" whatever American contingent in Cuba "intelligence" gathering and persuasion of the Cubans towards capitalism.....

> I don't want to really start a political
> debate on U.S. policy but it does not seem
> any more unpatriotic than visiting the
> former "Evil Empire" and its
> satellites before they cracked open.

*Let me emphasize--this is not a matter of "should". My British friends are doing their damnest to convert the common people of Cuba to capitalism one dollar at a time. The *only* problem here is official US policy towards Cuba, which has NEVER made any sense since Soviet military equipment left the island in the 1960s. Right now, about the ONLY country we have draconian economic sanctions against is Cuba--and we're the ONLY country (except maybe the Marshall Islands) continuing this. The laws are more explicit about travel to Cuba than against travel to North Korea!

I think it really is safe to say that the escapades of Mike Eagleson and Ron Ziel behind the Iron Curtain in the 1970s were basically an educational mission. They did what they did in the same way as O. Winston Link documenting life in Virginia in the 1950s.

Basically, as I understand it now, a Trains Unlimited-style "foamer" junket to Cuba will soon be off limits. However, *should* TRAIN, ARM, or whoever mount a serious repatriation campaign, I think an exploratory mission to find out what's left would not be out of the question.

LNER4472-NOSPAM-@bcpl.net

> I certainly have known or heard of more than
> a few American railfans who have visited
> Cuba in the last 20 years. Some averted U.S.
> policy by going through Mexico or Canada or
> joining foreign rail tour groups. Others
> actually got official U.S. sanction to
> travel there--rare or not.
> Has Trains Unlimited Tours ever gone there?
> I don't want to really start a political
> debate on U.S. policy but it does not seem
> any more unpatriotic than visiting the
> former "Evil Empire" and its
> satellites before they cracked open.
> I wish I had the time, money, and
> opportunity to go there. Actually, the
> Hershey electric stuff fascinates me more
> than the steam.
Mr Kaplan- Trains Unlimited ran tours to Cuba in 2001,02 & 03. I was on all of them. As of March 2003, 3 old Brill cars still existed on the Hershey line- only one still operable, the other two being used as trailers. With the closing of the sugar mill at Hershey, very little electric powered freight still runs.

as1210@comcast.net

> As much as this board is dedicated to RR
> preservation, lets not forget what (who) is
> the problem in Cuba.

> For four decades one individual has turned
> what should be a small paradise into a
> wasteland and reduced a bright and
> industrious people into scavengers to
> maintain the ruthlessly enforced myth of the
> socialist paradise. Only a fawning idiot
> with all the sophistication of an awestruck
> schoolgirl like Barbara Walters or some
> assorted ninnies from Hollyweird would think
> of Castro as anything more than a
> "target of opportunity" to be
> eliminated.

> The great tragedy of Cuba isn't the
> disappearance of the scraps of our exported
> industrial halcyon (when we still can't seem
> to persuade our own citizenry that the
> domestic reminders of the past matter,
> except for a tiny few)- Its the
> disappearance of PEOPLE who dare speak ill
> of the fuhrer, er leader.

> Every field needs ethics- and I realize much
> of this thread is daydreaming-assuming we
> were actually capable of raising the money
> to repatriate a locomotive and then doing an
> end run around the embargo would be a crime
> against humanity if the proceeds supported
> this "government". In addition it
> would be a crime against this nation.

> Finally, what about all the stuff that's
> ALREADY here and rotting in parks? What a
> waste to spend money to bring something back
> when it could be spent in preservation.

> Lets be honest, outside a few engines that
> went there second-hand, whats in Cuba has
> little significance relative to what we
> can't take of now. Charity begins at home,
> folks.
Pre Fidel Cuba may have been a paradise for American tourists, American sugar mill owners & the mafia, but if you read your Cuban history you'll see it was anything but a paradise for the average Cuban worker.

bas1210@comcast.net

> Pre Fidel Cuba may have been a paradise for
> American tourists, American sugar mill
> owners & the mafia, but if you read your
> Cuban history you'll see it was anything but
> a paradise for the average Cuban worker.

Please see my ADMIN post "Moderator weighing in" immediately above. I am requesting in the strongest possible terms that we relegate debates over Cuban history--rich and complex though it might be--to some other forum than this one. Unless the topic deals directly with railway preservation it is beyond the scope of this board.


eledbetter@rypn.org