One small correction, the horsecar at the Baltimore Streetcar Museum is #129 and is currently mounted on steel wheels with rubber tires for use in parades.
> This is by no means a complete list, but
> here are the cars I am aware of:

> Known Preserved horse cars

> California

> Woodland Railroad, Woodland CA, 3Â’ gauge,
> single truck, in Hendrick Museum

> San Francisco Horse car, San Jose Historic
> Railroad, Kelly Park, San Jose, CA,

> Oakland Railroad 8, Hammond 1887, Society
> for the Preservation of Carter Railroad
> Resources, Ardenwood Historic Farm, Fremont,
> CA

> San Francisco Sutter Street Railway, Shinn
> House, Fremont CA

> San Francisco, Sutter Street Railway, Cable
> Car Museum, San Francisco CA

> San Luis Obisbo Street Railway Holt, 1887,
> body at Dallidet Abobe, 1185 Pacific St,
> (photo, T&M 8-75, p14)

> Sacramento City, County Archives, former
> Sacramento Car, via Louis Stein

> Orange Empire Museum, Perris CA, three cars,

> 1) San Francisco Sutter Street Railway

> 2) Pasadena car

> Travel Town, Los Angeles CA

> Los Angeles open car

> Other US

> North Chicago Street Railroad 8, Stephenson,
> 1859 Illinois Railroad Museum, Union Ill

> No. 10, New Bedford Mass, Brill, 1885, 16Â’
> closed car
> No. 12, Fitchburg Mass, Brill, 1886, 7 bench
> open car
> both at Seashore Trolley Museum,
> Kenabunkport ME

> Baltimore City Passenger Railway 128,
> Stephenson, circa 1880, Baltimore Streetcar
> Museum

> Dallas Texas, Stephenson 6 window, closed
> car, 1882, property of Ed Landrum,
> associated with the McKinney Ave Street
> Railroad

> Canada

> Quebec Street Railroad, Stephenson, circa
> 1880, Canadian Railroad Museum, DELSON/
> SAINT-CONSTANT, Quebec, Canada

> Other

> Stephenson export car, National Railroad
> Museum, York England,

> Randy Hees,
> SPCRR, Newark CA


BTC7407@aol.com

The Chicago Surface Lines (later Chicago Transit Authority) collection contained two horsecars, one of which was replica built in the early part of the 20th Century, so by way of having some of the original artists and patterns around, it may well have been as good as an original. The replica is today at the Museum of Science and Industry, while the other is at the Illinois Railway Museum. The latter also was featured in the movie "The Babe" but that probably will be its last service use.

I see now that you need to delete picture URLs from the optional lines in the post, or else they will continue to be posted every time you jot something down!

> There was a nice one at Railfair, pulled by
> a horse no less!

The operating Railfair exhibit was a cooperative effort. Society for the Preservation of Carter Brother Railroad Resources (SCPRR) provide the 0-2-2-0 motive power named "Jiggs".

The horse car originally operated as Central RR #7 in San Francisco between 1864 and 1890's before becoming a garden shed. The car remains stored operable, barring availabity of a horse, in our trolley barn at the San Jose Historical Museum.

Ken Middlebrook
California Trolley and Railroad Corporation



ken.middlebrook@nsc.com

Indiana Transportation Museum in Noblesville, Indiana has an Indianapolis Horsecar on display.

jkissinger@hotmail.com

Randy,

Did you forgot the horsecar inside its own glass-walled building in Ontario, California? The building is in the center median of Euclid Avenue just north (I think) of Holt Blvd.

It's suppose to be the one that used to run up and down the street before the electric cars came. It has a 4-wheel cart behind it for the horse to ride down the hill--complete with fake horse.

Brian

bnorden@gateway.net

> The Chicago Surface Lines (later Chicago
> Transit Authority) collection contained two
> horsecars, one of which was replica built in
> the early part of the 20th Century, so by
> way of having some of the original artists
> and patterns around, it may well have been
> as good as an original. The replica is today
> at the Museum of Science and Industry, while
> the other is at the Illinois Railway Museum.
> The latter also was featured in the movie
> "The Babe" but that probably will
> be its last service use.

I wouldn't say that the "Babe" movie use will be its last run. After all, we just need the front half of a horse to make it run (like all organizations, we have an excess of the back halves...)


Kevinmccabe@avenew.com

Kevin,
Of course IRM could use it again, but as a rare piece of history that for the most part has lived out of the weather for the last 90 years, it may be a bit too fragile to play with very much. It is a good case for conservation. Ask Frank about the screws that were popping out of it as it rolled around for the movie.

> Kevin,
> Of course IRM could use it again, but as a
> rare piece of history that for the most part
> has lived out of the weather for the last 90
> years, it may be a bit too fragile to play
> with very much. It is a good case for
> conservation. Ask Frank about the screws
> that were popping out of it as it rolled
> around for the movie.

Well, if we did use it again, it certainly wouldn't be alone at IRM in having a few screws loose - either among the equipment or among the volunteers!

I do hope, however, that we would consider using it again if the right (read as: profitable) opportunity came along. We've even got the rubber tires that CTA built so they could haul it down the street!

Oops, I meant another Frank (Sirinek).
Yeah, I rode the horsecar once around Barn 8 (now 10) as it was on rubber tires and we were pulled by a small tractor. I would now rather see it sit inside in static display, with an occasional posing outdoors, but not in any kind of service that stresses the structure of the car.

Hello: We've had an interesting conversation about horse cars and horsecars and discovered that we are talking about two different things. Funk and Wagnalls unabridged dictionary of 1931 prefers a hyphen and lists two meanings: horse-car 1. A car drawn by horses; tram-car. 2. a car for transporting horses by rail. Perhaps it would be easy to differentiate the meanings if we used the form horsecar for the first meaning and horse car for the second meaning. Bob Reich

RJReich@aol.com

Greetings,

I'll have to keep that in mind. I'll at least say horse express car or something to that effect when speaking of the head end type.

Thanks,
Gerald Kopiasz, President
Heartland Railroad Historical Society

Heartland Railroad Historical Society
hrrhs@aol.com

>Check out the museum in Old Town, Albuquerque.

Harry Nicholls

This is by no means a complete list, but
> here are the cars I am aware of:

> Known Preserved horse cars

> California

> Woodland Railroad, Woodland CA, 3Â’ gauge,
> single truck, in Hendrick Museum

> San Francisco Horse car, San Jose Historic
> Railroad, Kelly Park, San Jose, CA,

> Oakland Railroad 8, Hammond 1887, Society
> for the Preservation of Carter Railroad
> Resources, Ardenwood Historic Farm, Fremont,
> CA

> San Francisco Sutter Street Railway, Shinn
> House, Fremont CA

> San Francisco, Sutter Street Railway, Cable
> Car Museum, San Francisco CA

> San Luis Obisbo Street Railway Holt, 1887,
> body at Dallidet Abobe, 1185 Pacific St,
> (photo, T&M 8-75, p14)

> Sacramento City, County Archives, former
> Sacramento Car, via Louis Stein

> Orange Empire Museum, Perris CA, three cars,

> 1) San Francisco Sutter Street Railway

> 2) Pasadena car

> Travel Town, Los Angeles CA

> Los Angeles open car

> Other US

> North Chicago Street Railroad 8, Stephenson,
> 1859 Illinois Railroad Museum, Union Ill

> No. 10, New Bedford Mass, Brill, 1885, 16Â’
> closed car
> No. 12, Fitchburg Mass, Brill, 1886, 7 bench
> open car
> both at Seashore Trolley Museum,
> Kenabunkport ME

> Baltimore City Passenger Railway 128,
> Stephenson, circa 1880, Baltimore Streetcar
> Museum

> Dallas Texas, Stephenson 6 window, closed
> car, 1882, property of Ed Landrum,
> associated with the McKinney Ave Street
> Railroad

> Canada

> Quebec Street Railroad, Stephenson, circa
> 1880, Canadian Railroad Museum, DELSON/
> SAINT-CONSTANT, Quebec, Canada

> Other

> Stephenson export car, National Railroad
> Museum, York England,

> Randy Hees,
> SPCRR, Newark CA


Fuzzymoney@worldnet.att.net