http://www.tnonline.com/online/localnews/02tuesday/carbon.html

According to the news article above, the provate owners of railcars in Jim Thorpe have until November 22nd second to remove their equipment. On that date, the purported historical group The Lackawanna Chapter of the Railway & Locomotive Historical Society, Inc. will scrap the track in the yard owned by them. Can you believe this is being done by the R&LS? A group that Bill Withun is VP of?

Additionally, George Hart has until December 31st to vacate the county property. Will be interesting, since I am sure the NS will not accept everything he has in interchange.

If any of this equipment gets torched due to shortsightedness, it would be a travesty.

So, what can you do?

Express your outrage today. I have already begun by contacting the media.

Rob



How can you do this? Here are some ideas:

Write letter to the local newspapers.
Lehighton Time Online: [url]rurban@tnonline.com[/url]
Morning Call: http://www.mcall.com/news/opinion/all-submitletters,0,1896250.customform?coll=all-newsopinion-utl

Contact local officials:
County Commissioners cccommis@ptd.net (570) 325-3611

Mail the R&LS and the Lackawanna Chapter and tell them to stop:
(addresses posted on R&LS web site)
http://www.rrhistorical-2.com/rlhs/


Ask the Reading & Northern to provide temporary storage for all the historic equipment:
Reading & Northern Railroad P.O. Box 218 Port Clinton, PA 19549 Phone: 610.562.2100 Fax: 610.562.1920

,

Your link to the article does not work.

Tim

Just to clarify--Bill Withhun is VP of the national R&LHS. He is not an officer of the Chapter which is party to these actions. While the national organization may be able to exert a degree of moral suasion over the Lackawanna Chapter, I doubt it has any constitutional authority over the actions of the Chapter.

Erik,

You are correct about Bill. However, I am not one to forgive the R&LHS for the actions of its chapters. That's like saying the US federal government wouldn't be held accountable if Rhode Island attacked Canada.

My call here for Mr. Withun and the other leaders in the R&LHS is to stand up and be heard. Does the R&LHS condone this action or is the chapter acting as a renegade? If so, will there be sanctions?

I want to know if an organization with the word "historical" in its legal title is really going to go out an scrap a railline and displace privately owned historic equipment?

If, indeed, the R&LHS or any of its chapters is functioning in such a manner, it calls into question the basic legitamacy of the organization - from the very top all the way down.

Rob

Perhaps the website was busy, it worked for me. -- Ray

George Hart was a great instrument in the preservation of many pieces of historic rail equipment, and I thank him for preserving the equipment and for giving many generations of children and adults their first taste of operating steam equipment. One thing that bothers me about this whole situation is why did George Hart give away the track without providing an alternate storage site for the historic equipment. In this day and age it is near to impossible to move historic equipment over a class 1 railroad, particularly wooden equipment.

Respectufully, no, its not. The two situations are not really very closely analogous at all, that's the point I was trying to make. I very much doubt that the parent R&LHS has any legal, constitutional or bylaws power to coerce the chapter. Legally they are probably--I am not certain, but pretty sure--almost completely separate entities.

The national organization can make statements, vote condemnations, issue press releases, and exert many other forms of persuasion if they choose to, but I expect they have little or no coercive authority.

My point in raising this is that I feel its best to be specific when calling on people, by name, in public, to take actions--one should ask for actions that are clearly within the powers of the person publically singled out.

I get very worried when I hear the word "purported" used as a qualifier.

I think instead of talking about Bill in the third person, somebody place a call.

I will do so tomorrow.

Assuming the local chapter is acting up, I bet the sole power the national has is to withdraw the chapter's right-sort of like an old time "morals" clause .

So far we have conjecture and know nothing.

Hi E-

I'll agree to disagree. The Chapter is part of an organization that authorizes it existence. I will not absolve the R&LHS from this mess, as it is being done in their name.

My mention of Mr. Withun's name was not to blame him. I was shocked when I went to the R&LHS web site to see that he was an executive. In that shock, what I meant to do was make the statement that the irresponsible behavior in Jim Thorpe is directly (and here's where we disagree) linked to a group whose executives include a person of such undeniable stature.

And - again where we disagree - I believe the R&LHS national officers have a role to play here, in a meaningful way.

And I will also end my thoughts on this topic here. It is obviosuly something I feel emotional about, and I've said more than enough. In the end, it matters not what I think. If these actions are what historic groups do, then it is up to our community as a whole to accept of reject that notion.

Rob

I'll give you a greater reason to be worried, which I will share with you privately. This mess is not isolated.

If you do give Mr. Withun a call, implore him to inject a bit of reason into this.

Rob

Before everyone jumps on the Lackawanna Chapter of the R&LHS as the bad-guy in the sad saga that's unfolding in Jim Thorpe one needs to learn the true facts.
As a member of the Chapter, I have followed the developments in Jim Thorpe carefully over the last year and can tell you that the Chapter did everything possible to enter into good faith discussions with the County to work out some arrangement to save the trackage and provide Mr. Hart with a place to keep his equipment.
It was glaringly evident from the get-go that the County had decided to put all its eggs in the R&N basket and evidently felt that that the Chapter was bluffing and would just let its asset lie there until the land/lease expired on 12/31/04 and which point the County would claim "trespassing" and sieze the track&turntable. As the saying goes- possession is 9/10ths. of the law- and the Chapter was left with only 2 options. 1. Take no action and lose the assets by default,or2. get a scrapper and at least get the $$$$ from the scrap value.
The worst part of where it seems the situation is now headed is the high probability that most of George Harts cars will probably be scrapped in place as they are not interchangeable and with the track about to be removed they'll have no home. Hopefully the same won't prove true of the steamer that's still there???
Perhaps the R&N will come forward as a "good guy" and help George get his equipment moved to some unused siding somewhere on the R&N so it can escape the scrappers torch starting on 11/22????
Time will tell! Ross Rowland

Ross,

In my opinion, these actions as described are inexcusable from an organization that claims to be dedicated to rail history.

Why not say " the preservation of these artifacts is the greater good here, so we will make sure that eveything stays in place, even if we don't get a dime"?

This entire charade puts both the chapter and the R&LHS in a very negative light.

Is this how the chapter wants to be remembered, as the group that evicted preserved rail cars and scrapped a turntable and trackage that survived 50 years past the end of steam?

I urge the Chapter to take the high road and leave the infrastructure in place and walk away from JT with everything intact. There are plenty of other ways to raise dollars.

I doubt there is anyone in rail preservation who will thank the Chapter and the R&LHS for what they are about to do. It is a black day in rail preservation when it comes to these spiteful tactics.

Ross, you and your fellow Chapter members can save this site from the torch. For the larger good, please do so.

Rob

What was Mr. Hart's intention in giving the stuff to the chapter in the first place? He probably wanted it preserved and most people donate things to historic groups for the purpose of preservation. So in simple terms we have the following:

Someone donates items for preservation to a group that's very purpose it railroad history.

The group is being led by people who have a agenda that is not about railroad history. Working to preserve historic items should be more important than cash.

If they are not about railroad history then what are they about? Profit? Maybe someone needs to talk to the IRS about checking the tax exempt status of the chapter and even the parent organization as well. We as the taxpayers are granting them a tax exempt status because they are doing good for our society and serving a purpose. If they are out to turn a profit maybe they need to be examined by the IRS. After all if they saying they should be tax exempt because they are a historic group and they don't follow through they are costing the rest of us money. It has been said before, follow the money trail.

Tom Gears

Rob, You're missing a key point here. The County has already put Mr. Hart on notice that his contract will not be renewed(it expires on 12/31/04) and thus he's got to find a new home.
All the Chapter would accomplish by doing nothing would be to let the County aquire the assets(track and whatsever on it) by default!
The only slim hope is that the R&N comes forward with an offer to assisst in some manner. To date they've been silent.
Ross Rowland