Note they have decided not to use the old Winton engine, after spending much time and $ to make it operable again.

Flying Yankee Restoration to Pull into Lincoln Station.

Renovation work
could be completed
in Lincoln, N.H.
By SALLY L. ANDERSON

Contributing Writer

The heartbeat of the Flying Yankee restoration for the past seven
years has come from the Claremont Concord Railroad, where the 1935
"Silver Slipper" has undergone near microscopic scrutiny.
Thousand and thousands of parts were dismantled and much of the
metal reconstructed' in preparation for its restoration here.
But those years of investment and time may be coming to a close
soon, according to both Claremont Concord Railroad and Flying Yankee
Restoration Group Officials. The train set may be headed to Lincoln,
N.H., in the White Mountains despite a detailed proposal to finish the
restoration work here that was submitted to the state last February by
Claremont Concord Railroad.
After completing a detailed evaluation of, the entire train,
including the work completed to date, the New Hampshire Department of
Transportation and the FYRG have agreed to move forward to phase II of
restoration, said Paul Giblin of Glen, NH., who has served as project
consultant for the past 11 months. This will involve the work of
specialized subcontractors and vendors located outside of; the
immediate area.
He said the decision to move the Flying Yankee came on the heels
of a months-long evaluation by train expert Gaetan Savoie of Montreal,
Canada, who assessed what has been done and what needs to be done.
Giblin said Savoie gave marks for work that had been done to date, but
said now that the heavy structural work had been done, it would be more
economical to subcontract the rest of the work.
"It wasn't a decision made lightly," Giblin said. "We need to move
it, get it out of their way and make it more accessible."
Broadening accessibility to the train by tourists and rail fans
would help raise funds to complete the restoration and establish an
endowment to preserve the train and keep it running, he.said.
With the structural renovation accomplished, referred to by Giblin
as phase 1, the financially strapped project will be setting its sights
on moving the three-piece train set and all of its disassembled parts
to the Plymouth and Lincoln Railroad in Lincoln. The railroad there is
owned by Ben Clark, who operates the tourist excursion train known as
the Hobo Railroad.
Once in Lincoln, the Flying Yankee will be set up on blocks as its
trucks (wheel sets) go out for refurbishing, Giblin said. He said there
the train set will be much more accessible to the public, and the gift
shop at the Hobo will be renovated to make room for a Flying Yankee
display that details its history.
A major change in the restoration effort will be removal of the
original Winton engine and replacement with an "off-the-shelf," smaller
and more efficient diesel engine, Giblin said. He said the reason for
doing that is that the old Winton would not be reliable.
The move is epected to take place sometime in the first two weeks of
January, depending upon the weather, accordimg to Giblin. Although
Giblin said the decision to move the Flying Yankee to Lincoln was made
by both state transportation officials and the restoration group,
Claremont Concord Railroad General Manager Lori Barnes finds the
abrubtness of the decision very suspicious.
"Carol Murray, commissioner of transportation, told me on December 8
that they had no plans to proceed forward," Barnes said. "Then we found
out (last week) they were going to move the Flying Yankee."
Because the Flying Yankee was hand built on the floor of the Budd
shop, Barnes said that pre-fabricating components and installing them
won't work. And she said the plan to replace the Winton engine with a
new engine would mean that the train would not be authentically restored,
which is what people who donated funds to the project understood was
the plan.
"We protected this project and researched it backwards and forwards,"
Barnes said. "It received the American Welding Society's award, because
of the excellence of the work done by a local Welder."
The cost for the Claremont Concord Railroad to complete the balance
of the work would be less than $1 million, Barnes said.
Giblin agreed that the work that's been done was very good, and that
the Flying Yankee is now structurally very solid. However, he disagreed
about how much it would cost to finish. He said the restoration group's
estimate based on the evaluation recently completed called for $1.5
million to finish
the project.
So far $2.6 million has been spent on the restoration. Once the train
is finished, the tentative plan is to have it parked in Concord and
available for education from the fall through spring, and run seasonally
in different parts of the state. The Winton engine would also be set up
as an educational display to show the engine that revolutionized
railroading.

Here are some interesting comments on Sally Anderson's article by Scott J. Whitney:

Here's my thoughts on parts of the Flying Yankee matter for better or for worse. Remember, these are just my personal opinions based on my observations of the whole affair.

[Thousand and thousands of parts were dismantled and much of the metal reconstructed' in preparation for its restoration here.]

Yes, this is true. However, much of the work on the Flying Yankee to date has/had been based on the pipe dreams and near total mechanical ignorance of the Flying Yankee Restoration Group. The unrealistic asperations of the group had been aimed not at a historically accurate reconstruction but at the twisted goal of trying to blend historical accuracy with modern Amtrak compatibility. This is just not possible.

[Transportation and the FYRG have agreed to move forward to phase II of restoration, said Paul Giblin of Glen, NH., who has served as project consultant for the past 11 months. This will involve the work of specialized subcontractors and vendors located outside of the immediate area.]

Interesting... I wouldn't have thought that both Claremont and Lincoln were in the same state. Therefore, wouldn't it be more accurate to say that the folks at Claremont Concord have been FIRED from the project and the good folks at Lincoln have been hired? Also interesting is now the project has suddenly developed two "phases." This is something that was never mentioned before and I don't believe ever was intended to exist. Smoke and mirror show anyone?

[He said the decision to move the Flying Yankee came on the heels of a months-long evaluation by train expert Gaetan Savoie of Montreal, Canada, who assessed what has been done and what needs to be done. Giblin said Savoie gave marks for work that had been done to date, but said now that the heavy structural work had been done, it would be more economical to subcontract the rest of the work.]

I would be interested in this gentleman's background. I suspect that he may have rail experience in the passenger field and that is a major plus for the project. If this is so, it will be the first time that the FYRG has proceeded in what I see is the correct direction. The second part of that paragraph refers to "heavy structural work" having been done. Here again is where historical restoration and operation on a Class I railroad scale don't mingle well.

My own experience in maintaining Budd built (1937, just two years newer than the FY) equipment has shown me that they were built to last and that some (certainly not all) of the major surgery the FY has received was totally unwarranted. A few of these items are as follows: electric vs steam or hot water heating; 480V three phase motors on air conditioning equipment; the HEP generator required for this heat and AC; a totally custom air brake installation; cab signalling equipment. NONE of these items is a benefit to the FY restoration. They have all accounted for an astronomical increase in the cost of the project which has soared far above original estimates.

Originally, the Winton engine was to be retained and the reasoning of "historical accuracy" was cited. In my opinion, it was more like historical lunacy to retain the Winton and to alter so many other parts of the FY's systems. Fortunately, as stated later in the article, the Winton will now be sidelined in favor of something reliable and modern. The downside to this is the extraordinary amount of time, money and effort that already went into the Winton reconstruction. This amounts to a total waste of those efforts.

["It wasn't a decision made lightly," Giblin said. "We need to move it, get it out of their way and make it more accessible."]

Get it out of their way? Who's, CCRR's? Last I knew they wanted it there to finish the project.

[Broadening accessibility to the train by tourists and rail fans would help raise funds to complete the restoration and establish an endowment to preserve the train and keep it running, he.said.]

I can't argue with that logic.

[With the structural renovation accomplished, referred to by Giblin as phase 1, the financially strapped project will be setting its sights on moving the three-piece train set and all of its disassembled parts to the Plymouth and Lincoln Railroad in Lincoln. The railroad there is owned by Ben Clark, who operates the tourist excursion train known as the Hobo Railroad.]
[Once in Lincoln, the Flying Yankee will be set up on blocks as its trucks (wheel sets) go out for refurbishing, Giblin said. He said there the train set will be much more accessible to the public, and the gift shop at the Hobo will be renovated to make room for a Flying Yankee display that details its history.]

I can truthfully say that I can think of no place better qualified to finish the work on the FY than up at Lincoln. I know Ben quite well and his work in restoration is outstanding. Of course it helps that I have a friend or two that are working for him as well! I've had conversation with Ben in the past about the FY and many of my own concerns were heard by him. Thusly, I know that he may be able to shine some light on the FYRG's plans and help them to re-focus.

[A major change in the restoration effort will be removal of the original Winton engine and replacement with an "off-the-shelf," smaller and more efficient diesel engine, Giblin said. He said the reason for doing that is that the old Winton would not be reliable.]

This was the best news that I have heard to date. I was a major proponent of removing the Winton soon after the project got off the ground. Perhaps somebody out there really did hear me after all but I really expect that sensible heads really do think alike. The sad part is, as I already have mentioned, that the Winton has seen truckloads of money dumped into it. Not mentioned is if the FYRG is going to still insist on using the current main and auxilliary generators and switchgear. Gotta face facts here... The there is NO room for failure of these old components! If they fail, you have to tear them out and have them repaired at immense cost.

[The move is epected to take place sometime in the first two weeks of January, depending upon the weather, accordimg to Giblin. Although Giblin said the decision to move the Flying Yankee to Lincoln was made by both state transportation officials and the restoration group, Claremont Concord Railroad General Manager Lori Barnes finds the abrubtness of the decision very suspicious.]

Indeed it is suspicious. Even more so is the fact that the FYRG had already decided on the move PRIOR to the American Welding Society's award cerimony. The decision announcement was perposely delayed until afterward so as to avoid the embarassment of the CCRR and several individuals being given their walking papers. How do I know this? I was tipped off BEFORE the award date that "something" was going down but was being hushed.

["Carol Murray, commissioner of transportation, told me on December 8 that they had no plans to proceed forward," Barnes said. "Then we found out (last week) they were going to move the Flying Yankee."]
[Because the Flying Yankee was hand built on the floor of the Budd shop, Barnes said that pre-fabricating components and installing them won't work. And she said the plan to replace the Winton engine with a new engine would mean that the train would not be authentically restored, which is what people who donated funds to the project understood was the plan.]

This indeed is quite true... Many people I know that donated money are a bit alarmed at how the project has been proceeding. On the plus side, an equal number will be just happy to see it finished in any form.

["We protected this project and researched it backwards and forwards," Barnes said. "It received the American Welding Society's award, because of the excellence of the work done by a local Welder."]

Yes, the CCRR did research the project. However, many of their sensible recommendations were ignored by the FYRG in their quest for their lofty goal of seeing the FY run on Amtrak's Northeast Corridor. What a joke!!! Want a simple opinion? The first time the FY breaks down on Amtrak will also be the LAST time!

[The cost for the Claremont Concord Railroad to complete the balance of the work would be less than $1 million, Barnes said.]

I'm quite sure that COULD be an accurate figure if those that don't know beans about railroad equipment would keep thier noses out of the project.

[Giblin agreed that the work that's been done was very good, and that the Flying Yankee is now structurally very solid. However, he disagreed about how much it would cost to finish. He said the restoration group's estimate based on the evaluation recently completed called for $1.5 million to finish the project.]

Anyone remember the ORIGINAL cost estimates? They were alot lower.

[So far $2.6 million has been spent on the restoration. Once the train is finished, the tentative plan is to have it parked in Concord and available for education from the fall through spring, and run seasonally in different parts of the state. The Winton engine would also be set up as an educational display to show the engine that revolutionized railroading.]

Displaying and laying over the FY around the State will be a nightmare. The mistake of having 480V three phase equipment installed will forever doom the FY to either keeping its HEP generator running or being relegated to display at just a few locations that can supply the needed power. 480V three phase power is not readily available and must be installed at great expense wherever the train will pay even a slightly extended visit.

To sum it all up, the FY will some day be completed. I also believe that we have only just begun to see the headaches that will be caused by all the previous errors in judgement. I think I'll donate some money to the B&M 3713 project instead.....

SJW



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Well both posts were depressing. Largely because we get to see what is
going on.
One of my big peeves with US RR restorations is that most are not. Sure
can understand why, operations and all. But I for one have little or
no interest in seeing a train with a new engine. Just as we go to
HEAR steam, we wish to HEAR what an historic diesel sounds like.
Why not just go to Disneyland instead of a RR museum?
When I was young, I fooled around with "old cars". The first
thing my boss said when it was cold and the car's battery was too
weak to crank was "put and alternator in it". In fact, this was common
idea.
But having run cars of the 30's and 40's for 15 years in daily operation,
I found that a good generator and battery were quite reliable and
ORIGINAL. Why not just plop in a small block V8 and be done with it?
Why not just drive a hot rod? Well, because we wish to experience
what a 1938 car was all about.
Same thing with the train: I want to see, hear and feel the original
experience not a "colorful recreation of America's Non-existant past"!
I know, I know, it can't be done. Well, no, not if you don't do it.

This news begs quite a few substantive questions such as : 1) Why was it so important to make the train 'Amtrak compatible'; 2) If this design parameter was deemed to be of such importance-why attempt to re-construct the original propulsion system ? and 3) Given the extreme change in direction of the project-one might argue 'misrepresentation..'

I find the comparison between 'old cars' and 'antique' diesel locomotives to be falacious, at best. I say this having spent almost seventy years 'messing around' with things of a mechanical/electrical nature-autos and locomotives.

While there is an extant infrastructure to support the operation of many models of old cars, there is nothing of the kind to support superannuated d/e locos...or old passenger cars-or many other types of obsolete railroad equipment.

For those who operate steam locomotives today, the process of maintenance hasn't changed all that much from when steam ruled the nations' rail scene. If one needs a part, one makes it-using 'basic' materials and 'standard' techniques of construction.

In contrast, d/e locomotives are a whole different breed of cat. The size and complexity of various sub-assemblies rules out 'easy' duplication of items as 'simple' as a diesel engine piston or cylinder liner. This kind of thing can cost some fairly serious money to accomplish.

So, in my view, it is not unreasonable to replace the 'powertrain' on an item like the FY with something more modern and supportable in 2004.

To put it another way, if the mission of the project is to have an item that is operable-decisions having to do with mechanical/electrical equipment have to be viewed in a different light versus an item on display.

As usual. the direction of these types of undetakings seems to be governed by those who have little or no practical experience wiith d/e motive power.

OLG