I was surprised to read that Bayshore was the last SP Roundhouse in California. I have to ask, what other SP Roundhouses remain?

Oregon

Brooklyn yard, 4 stall

Eugene, ?

Smokebox,

The Brooklyn roundhouse is pretty much the same as it was at the end of the steam era, still has the turntable and everything. I have never seen it, but I heard that the Eugene roundhouse is the last fully complete SP steam facility in existence. All the accompanying shops are apparently still there as well. For the time being, I think it's safe, CORP and UP still use it.

Thanks, Taylor

thrush@smt-net.com

Eugene is the most complete and best preserved. It is said to be little used, but typically, no one has even suggested it might be saved. The Brooklyn roundhouse at Portland is only a part of what used to be there; it is a WWII addition to the former brick roundhouse, which is gone.

With luck, San Jose's roundhouse will eventually be resurrected at the fairgrounds. The only other SP roundhouse I know of is a concrete shell (5 stalls, I think) at Lufkin, Texas, which appears from photos to be in fair shape, though long unused by the railroad. A similar concrete shell existed at Mexia, Texas until a few years ago, but was razed.

Smokebox,

> The Brooklyn roundhouse is pretty much the
> same as it was at the end of the steam era,
> still has the turntable and everything. I
> have never seen it, but I heard that the
> Eugene roundhouse is the last fully complete
> SP steam facility in existence. All the
> accompanying shops are apparently still
> there as well. For the time being, I think
> it's safe, CORP and UP still use it.

> Thanks, Taylor


bobyar2001@yahoo.com

I'm very surprised at how few SP roundhouses remain. To I have to ask, how many were used, from let's say 1900-1945? Mabey a state-by-state listing would be availible?

Don't know of a listing of SP facilities is available, but it may be somewhere. The Intermountain Chapter NRHS published a complete book listing all UP facilities (with considerable detail) in 1946. This is from UP records and is probably still available from the Colorado RR Museum. Railroad roundhouses are rare structures in the 21st Century. Too bad so few of us are interested in saving them.

I'm very surprised at how few SP roundhouses
> remain. To I have to ask, how many were
> used, from let's say 1900-1945? Mabey a
> state-by-state listing would be availible?


bobyar2001@yahoo.com

This really is a wake up call. I had no idea that so few (if any) remain. There is still enough left of Bayshore for possible preservation. I wonder what it would take...

magnetic_flagman@yahoo.com

From my brief observation, there is certainly enough left for preservation, though there would be many obstacles, the most recent being that the city will no doubt want to quickly clean up the dangerous rubble from the fire. First, there has to be a collective will among we preservationists to save such structures, and that so far is sadly lacking. I believe that comprehensive plans to save such facilities must see them developed as close as possible to the way they were in service, rather than the usual generic and eclectic railway museum concept ala' Steamtown and others. Unfortunately, the majority of our ranks still seem to think this is impossible.

This really is a wake up call. I had no idea
> that so few (if any) remain. There is still
> enough left of Bayshore for possible
> preservation. I wonder what it would take...


http://http://www.infoblvd.net/danno/8/
bobyar2001@yahoo.com

The problem that we up here in Portland have had, is there have been two attempts to preserve local brick roundhouses, and both were quickly demolished. We don't want "strike three", as there are very few places we can store and maintain the city owned locomotives. We at the roundhouse have had many talks with the local neighborhood group and others about NOT trying to get the roundhouse on a "historic" listing at this time. We currently have a good working relationship with the UP and the city, and we don't want to jeopardize that. The UP still doesn't know what the future of Brooklyn Yard is, and the city doesn't have the money to purchase the property, let alone clean up 100 years of heavy locomotive and shop residue.

The last ten or so years have brought on many obstacles to roundhouse preservations. The titles that hinder many roundhouse preservations are "superfund" and "urban growth boundary".

I consider myself very lucky to be a volunteer working on steam locomotives in a true steam era roundhouse. I know I'm at of the few places left in the USA that this is happening, and I charish every moment.

Smokebox

The toxic pollutants left by the railroads at roundhouse sites are certainly a problem, but they must be cleaned up whether the buildings are razed or not, and the polluting RRs are responsible for the cleanup. A number of roundhouse sites are on the EPA's list of superfund sites. On coalburning roads, most of this pollution occurred in the diesel era. The folks in Evanston, WY got "brownfields" funds for their site. It's more a matter of having the will to save the structures than finding funds to clean up the sites.

Urban/suburban growth problems are not limited to existing roundhouse sites. IRM, OERM and others have had to purchase adjacent property in recent years to thwart creeping suburbia and possible limitations on their activities imposed by nearby residents. In fact, existing railyards, having never been located in desirable areas, probably have less NIMBYs to deal with than newer "green field" sites.

The problem that we up here in Portland have
> had, is there have been two attempts to
> preserve local brick roundhouses, and both
> were quickly demolished. We don't want
> "strike three", as there are very
> few places we can store and maintain the
> city owned locomotives. We at the roundhouse
> have had many talks with the local
> neighborhood group and others about NOT
> trying to get the roundhouse on a
> "historic" listing at this time.
> We currently have a good working
> relationship with the UP and the city, and
> we don't want to jeopardize that. The UP
> still doesn't know what the future of
> Brooklyn Yard is, and the city doesn't have
> the money to purchase the property, let
> alone clean up 100 years of heavy locomotive
> and shop residue.

> The last ten or so years have brought on
> many obstacles to roundhouse preservations.
> The titles that hinder many roundhouse
> preservations are "superfund" and
> "urban growth boundary".

> I consider myself very lucky to be a
> volunteer working on steam locomotives in a
> true steam era roundhouse. I know I'm at of
> the few places left in the USA that this is
> happening, and I charish every moment.

> Smokebox


http://http://www.infoblvd.net/danno/8/
bobyar2001@yahoo.com

Seems like Bayshore should have no problem in this area. Can't think of many NIMBY issues there. It's not located near very many homes. Daly City/Brisbane isn't exactly prime real estate right now (that I'm aware of)...

Bob wrote:

> In fact, existing railyards,
> having never been located in desirable
> areas, probably have less NIMBYs to deal
> with than newer "green field"
> sites.

> The problem that we up here in Portland have


magnetic_flagman@yahoo.com

Brooklyn doesn't have the NIMBY problem. Actually it's very opposite. The roundhouse has been on the "neighborhood master plan" for many years, as being a future rail museum. But being so close to downtown, word is that if the property were to get redeveloped, the city looks at it as prime for new housing.

Smokebox