I made a rather long drive yesterday to attend the meeting of the B&M Historical Society and Mass Bay RRE, and see the presentation by Paul Giblin of the Flying Yankee Restoration Group. To follow up on some earlier discussions here, yes they do plan on auctioning additional parts from the 201A, he indicated that six of the eight original pistons are to be auctioned to raise money for the restoration. One has been auctioned already at the April 1 "gala".

The flyers that were distributed at the meeting indicated that $3.5 million more is needed to complete the restoration (in comparison, back around 2004 the website said $1.5 million more was needed to pay off an $800,000 loan and complete the restoration).

A "Naming Rights" program has been developed to raise money for the restoration. You can buy the naming rights for one of the three cars for a contribution of $500,000; the naming rights for the engine bay for $250,000; the name for the galley for $100,000; the name for the baggage compartment for $60,000; Or you can name one of the seats in the train for various contributions from $2500 to $25,000 depending on location in the train.

Questions were also asked about: What new engine system has been selected (still under study); Where will it be able to operate (everywhere); Will there be any speed restrictions (yes, less than 60 MPH); are any transportation engineering firms auditing the project for regulatory compliance (answer was sort of "no, the railroad is doing it and we talk to the state"); and projected completion (looks like 2009 in time for the 75th anniversary). It was also mentioned that on completion the individual cars will be fitted with special LCD viewing screens so that they can take groups of school children on rides and teach classes on the train.

If anyone else attended the meeting and got different impressions from the questions and answers, please provide your view on this. These things were going by pretty quickly as I was trying to take notes.

The silence is deafening.

IMHO, this project has many problems:

* Excessive cost relative to degree of interest in object
* Major change in project specification midstream
* Negative cost and timeframe implications relating to changes
* lack of regulatory compliance oversight by qualified engineering firm

Given that this train is a very early example of what is now an accepted form of railroad vehicle construction (stainless steel), there probably should have been more attention paid to the performance of a formal structural audit and documentation.

Yet another area that comes to mind is a flammability audit-with necessary adjustments to the various materials as required.

We could go and on here.

All and all, this thing could ultimately given the preservation industry a black eye.

Dave (my real name)

From a distance knowing just what I have read, it seems as if it is likely that the original hardware might not be the best to use for the intended purpose. Perhaps, if the goal was to restore the train set, some insular museum or tourist railroad where its materials and techniques would be appropriate standards for safe operaton without massively altering the fabric of it would have been a good choice. Alternatively, if a Yankee running on the High Iron is the goal replication of the style and form built to todays standards might have been easier.

You can spend over a half million rebuilding a 0-4-0T to the same standards that would allow a 4-8-4 to run on AMTRAK, but realistically, it is still a 0-4-0T, and AMTRAK probably won't be interested.

I just wonder what the goal is, and if it matches with the hardware chosen.

dave

I have to agree with NH401 and his doubts regarding this project. I recall reading somewhere some very hard feelings when this project "changed" direction and the equipment was moved elsewhere.

I just don't get the concept of all this type of fund-raising.

When you look at the $3.5 million needed to finish the project, and combine that with the $800,000 in previous loans that supposedly had to be repaid, plus whatever else went into trying to create replacement parts for the Winton engine, the cost of several relocations of the equipment, and the cost of restoration work already completed, I would suspect this project may exceed the cost of a brand new fully compliant passenger locomotive by the time it is done.

When you have to go back to your supporters over and over with announcements that the price of the project has gone up substantially since the last estimate, this can hardly inspire confidence that giving more money will do any good.

m.x.data (not my real name)

Why not? It's standard operating procedure for politicians, Congress, government projects.......... and people seem to fall for it every time.......

[rushes to don the asbestos jacketing before the wrath of Ye Moderators hits......]

All I can say is...touche'

I'm very frustrated with this project. I don't understand why they went to all of the expense to have all the work performed on that 201A, which would make it one of the only operable examples of that type in the country, and then somehow after having invested gobs of money into it, suddenly decided to change their mind.

Maybe I'm being a purist here, but to me seems like if someone were to take SP 4449 and cut a big hole in the boiler and stick a 567 between the frames to power it. How often are they really going to be able to use this trainset anyways? Would the added reliability really make any significant difference?

Regards,
Trevor H.

Doyle's PA won't have it's original prime mover either, but will that make it any less amazing and wonderful to see? Most posters on this board would agree that EVERY restoration is a "can of worms."

The original estimate for the SS Nobska restoration was $1.5 million. 10 years later they need an additional $1 million just to float her out of drydock.

It is what it is, a dream being turned into a reality.

There is so little left from the original PA locomotive that it has little historical relevance. We can measure this by dollar value, weight or volume if anyone cares to ? Besides, it is private property.

Once one starts to solicit the public, a different set of rules kicks in with
respect to the handling of funds. The United Way got into all types of trouble on this point.

As an artifact, the FY is now just about useless. Too bad.

For a lot less money than they will spend, they could have bought a retired F40 from AMTK, along with a few retired Comet I's from NJT and made up a nice little train.

Dave

I found it very strange in the Flying Yankee Restoration Group's presentation that after talking for some time about trying to restore the train with authentic materials (except for the Winton engine, the main generator, and the traction motors and some other stuff), they started talking about installing LCD panels on the walls so they can take loads of school childern on train rides and educate them about railroading.

If there is a need for that, what's wrong with doing it in a classroom?

At that point I thought about one of the original discarded Steamtown concepts that called for the turntable to have a wooden deck over the pit and a canopy on top, with bleachers all around, so they could put a steam locomotive on it and spin it around as spectators watched from the circle of seats while dancers did "interpretive" dance routines around it......